Looking over our losses this year

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G08
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Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
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Teddy KGB
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G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
I have no doubt Leno is going to be here for a few more years, but his talent level it is that of a quality backup.

The Bears would not be the first team to have locked up an okay left tackle only to draft a stud left tackle when the opportunity presented itself.

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G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
So I was taking a look at the draft prospects coming out, and it is not a very strong year for left tackles.  Mike McGlinchey is the highest rated Prospect and some have him as a right tackle. Key projects as a potential left tackle in the future.

That got me thinking: why not draft him in the first round to replace Massie. He should at the very least be a very good right tackle, and if he shows the ability to transition to left tackle, you can make that move a couple years in.

I would definitely draft McGlinchey in round one, and pick up either Wynn or Bozeman in the third round depending on who you like or who's available.

I would kick Whitehair over to left guard, put Wynn or Bozeman in at Center, Kush coming back from injury at RG until Kyle Long is 100% healthy, and McGlinchey at RT.

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G08
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I don't really like burning high draft picks on the offensive line unless it's left tackle. In my mind, you find a driven player that meets your height/weight/arm length needs and hits your athletic numbers and just drill technique into him. You can do that with 3rd and 4th rounders, IMO.

Look at the Patriots' line... left to right: 1st round pick, 3rd, Undrafted, 4th, 5th.
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Teddy KGB wrote:I think they will get Mitch help. I think if you just Place decent wide receivers around him this could go very well. However I believe the offensive line is very overrated.

I think next year we'll go as far as a new offensive line takes them. I seriously see white hair as being the only long-term mainstay and I see Leno as a valuable backup left tackle and left guard.

If I am the Bears, I go for veteran wide receivers next year and with the first pick of the draft next year I get a left tackle. I move Whitehair to guard, and draft a center and another guard or tackle.

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The offensive line has been perhaps my biggest disappointment this season.

We knew the WR group was poor even before Meredith and White went down, Glennon was a stop gap and Trubisky would need time etc., but the line had played well last season despite last minute changes and some injury issues.

I really expected them to gel this year and get even better but it didn't happen. I can't help but wonder how much Dave Magazu's departure as the o-line coach had a negative impact.

However, if you believe Pace is going to completely overhaul the offensive line this off-season then I think you're going to be sorely disappointed.

He just signed Leno to a $38m extension. You don't pay that sort of money for a backup, nor do you put LT at the top of your draft board the very next year. (It's irrelevant anyway, but as for being a backup LG I don't think Leno has ever played there, either in college or for the Bears, so I have no idea what you're basing that assertion on.)

I also have no idea why you'd want to move Whitehair from center and gamble on finding a better option in the draft. Pace spent a third round pick on Grasu and that didn't exactly pan out. Aside from some issues with shotgun snaps (which are hopefully now resolved) Whitehair's played well, has learned how to call NFL protections and should be left alone to continue his development without being shunted around like he was at times earlier this season.

As for the rest of the line, Sitton continues to play at a Pro Bowl level and Long's on a long-term contract. Hopefully the latter will finally get fully healed before the start of next season. Massie's not great and could well be replaced, perhaps with a draft pick, but he's still a hell of a lot better than the dross they sent out at RT prior to his arrival (Kyle Long aside). It was a shame Kush got injured before the season because he played well as a backup guard and can play center. He's under contract for next year and they also spent a draft pick on Morgan so they already have a young guard to develop.

Also, continuity is massively important to the o-line. Adding two or three rookies into the line-up is unlikely to result in a jump in performance and could well have the opposite effect.

For what it's worth, here are the current PFF grades (all freely available, not behind a pay wall) for our starting five for this season and those from last year:

Leno: 81.4 (Above Average), 70.8 (Average)
Sitton: 85.8 (High Quality), 85.5 (High Quality)
Whitehair: 73.2 (Average), 87.2 (High Quality)
Long: 73.0 (Average), 78.1 (Average)
Massie: 70.9 (Average), 69.2 (Below Average)

The idea of spending three draft picks, including our first rounder, on the offensive line makes no sense to me at all. This team has far greater needs at the moment.

On offense I'd put WR1, WR2 and TE1 ahead of a swing OT who can compete with Massie for a starting role and another OG.

On defense I'd put a starting OLB, a CB (if one or other of our current starters isn't re-signed), a quality DE to play opposite Hicks (keeping Unrein as a rotational guy) and probably a second OLB before another offensive lineman.
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Most NFL games come down to the wire, it’s just that bad teams lose most of them. The Colts and 49ers have 5 games they could have easily won. You can also say that the Bears are lucky they are not 2-11 right now. Hell, Matt Barkley should have won his first 4 starts late last season.
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G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
Much to my chagrin.
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Teddy KGB
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wab wrote:
G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
Much to my chagrin.
I wouldn't be shocked if they drafted a LT. All I am saying. Bears have cap space to burn, so its not like they are hamstrung.
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Teddy KGB wrote:
G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
So I was taking a look at the draft prospects coming out, and it is not a very strong year for left tackles.  Mike McGlinchey is the highest rated Prospect and some have him as a right tackle. Key projects as a potential left tackle in the future.

That got me thinking: why not draft him in the first round to replace Massie. He should at the very least be a very good right tackle, and if he shows the ability to transition to left tackle, you can make that move a couple years in.

I would definitely draft McGlinchey in round one, and pick up either Wynn or Bozeman in the third round depending on who you like or who's available.

I would kick Whitehair over to left guard, put Wynn or Bozeman in at Center, Kush coming back from injury at RG until Kyle Long is 100% healthy, and McGlinchey at RT.

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Teams really should be targeting BPA on day 1 of the draft and not focusing on drafting for a specific position. Why pass up a franchise CB or pass rusher simply because we need to move somebody to right tackle. You can sign an FA for that.
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Teddy KGB wrote:
wab wrote:
G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
Much to my chagrin.
I wouldn't be shocked if they drafted a LT. All I am saying. Bears have cap space to burn, so its not like they are hamstrung.
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G08 wrote:I don't really like burning high draft picks on the offensive line unless it's left tackle. In my mind, you find a driven player that meets your height/weight/arm length needs and hits your athletic numbers and just drill technique into him. You can do that with 3rd and 4th rounders, IMO.

Look at the Patriots' line... left to right: 1st round pick, 3rd, Undrafted, 4th, 5th.

Agree 100%, not a fan of drafting anybody but a top end LT before the 3rd round. Long was a 1st rounder and he has been very good when healthy, but guys like him often can be developed in the mid rounds.
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G08
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Teddy KGB wrote:
wab wrote:
G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
Much to my chagrin.
I wouldn't be shocked if they drafted a LT. All I am saying. Bears have cap space to burn, so its not like they are hamstrung.
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Yeah, I'll eat my hat if we try and replace leno.
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G08 wrote:
Teddy KGB wrote:
wab wrote:
G08 wrote:Leno's going to be here a few more years, and it will be at left tackle.
Much to my chagrin.
I wouldn't be shocked if they drafted a LT. All I am saying. Bears have cap space to burn, so its not like they are hamstrung.
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:thumbsup:
Exactly

The Leno hate is kind of silly. There are very few "elite" LT's in the league. What are there? Three? Four? This idea that a better option than Leno is floating around out there, just doesn't hold up. That small handful of elite tackles are clutched onto for dear life by those organizations.

I understand that he isn't perfect, but he's consistently serviceable to above average and he's never.... EVER hurt. That immediately checks him in at around the top ten mark for the position, IMO.

It's a ridiculously tough position, and most fans only notice a offensive lineman when he makes a mistake. This skews their perception of said player.
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In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
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G08 wrote:In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
I would check him in higher than 15th among LT's in the league. So, that's pretty solid.
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G08 wrote:In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
And that's in year one of his contract, he could be outside the top 20 in a couple of years.
"I wouldn't take him for a conditional 7th. His next contract will pay him more than he could possibly contribute.".

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I'm a firm believer that you are your record. I don't care how many "close" losses you have. Those games serve to separate the good teams from the bad, and the Bears are a bad team.

I'm sure the 0-16 Lions a few years back had a lot of "close" games too.
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ramentaschen wrote:I'm a firm believer that you are your record. I don't care how many "close" losses you have. Those games serve to separate the good teams from the bad, and the Bears are a bad team.

I'm sure the 0-16 Lions a few years back had a lot of "close" games too.
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malk wrote:
G08 wrote:In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
And that's in year one of his contract, he could be outside the top 20 in a couple of years.
Leno, 26, is a building block after signing a four-year, $37 million extension before the season, and he’s had better season than most think.

According to PFF, he’s allowed two sacks, three QB hits and 13 hurries on 416 pass-blocking snaps this season. His 18 total pressures are the seventh-fewest allowed among 52 qualified tackles.

The Bears also average more yards on runs to his side than to the right.
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ramentaschen wrote:I'm a firm believer that you are your record. I don't care how many "close" losses you have. Those games serve to separate the good teams from the bad, and the Bears are a bad team.

I'm sure the 0-16 Lions a few years back had a lot of "close" games too.
I agree with your overall point, but the 08 Lions actually didn’t have many close games. Only three were by less than 7 points.

They got outscored 517-268 that year. They may have been worse than 0-16.
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G08 wrote:
malk wrote:
G08 wrote:In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
And that's in year one of his contract, he could be outside the top 20 in a couple of years.
Leno, 26, is a building block after signing a four-year, $37 million extension before the season, and he’s had better season than most think.

According to PFF, he’s allowed two sacks, three QB hits and 13 hurries on 416 pass-blocking snaps this season. His 18 total pressures are the seventh-fewest allowed among 52 qualified tackles.

The Bears also average more yards on runs to his side than to the right.
You can’t make me like him!
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wab wrote:
G08 wrote:
malk wrote:
G08 wrote:In terms of average per year Leno ranks 15th in the NFL in compensation.
And that's in year one of his contract, he could be outside the top 20 in a couple of years.
Leno, 26, is a building block after signing a four-year, $37 million extension before the season, and he’s had better season than most think.

According to PFF, he’s allowed two sacks, three QB hits and 13 hurries on 416 pass-blocking snaps this season. His 18 total pressures are the seventh-fewest allowed among 52 qualified tackles.

The Bears also average more yards on runs to his side than to the right.
You can’t make me like him!
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