Maybe Trubisky just ain't that good.

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botfly10 wrote:
G08 wrote:Mitch just said on the 5 sacks that some of them were him "protecting the football".

That's awesome, coach the aggressiveness and playmaking out of him.


I fucking hate this team.
fuck everything

Fuck Pace for letting Fox waste this season cause he is trying to protect his job instead of develop the rookie
Fox is trying to protect his job? Er... it doesn't seem to be going too well in that regard does it?
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PapaDongo wrote:
Funkster wrote:Just stop, Trubisky has shown some rookie mistakes but he also is 100% being handcuffed by piss poor coaching and play calling, period. The poor kid doesn't have a chance and his mechanics are regressing because of it, resulting in inaccurate throws. Boo to you, BOO BOO BOO!
these excuses don't make sense to me at least, how does the playcall impact mechanics? Mechanics are on the player not the coaches choice of run or pass.

Maybe you can understand Clay Matthews explanation better?

Clay Matthews on Mitch Trubisky:

“His pocket presence will come along. You have to take advantage of that. That’s exactly what we did. We ended up with five sacks, a number of quarterback pressures and hurries. That’s what you expect to do when a team is so one dimensional."
“Protect this fucking house, go all out, leave that shit out on the field, let’s have some fun, makes some plays baby ” Mitch Trubisky #believethesleeve
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docc wrote:Might want to judge Trubisky at LEAST after his first offseason..

Dam this is stupid...
Watching the game 60 YEARS..
Many other good/great QBS had way more experience and better support but struggled WAY WORSE than Trubisky..

Think
I would wager more rookies played like crap than rookies came in looking great or just good. As for MT, we are seeing gradual improvement.
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Funkster wrote:
PapaDongo wrote:
Funkster wrote:Just stop, Trubisky has shown some rookie mistakes but he also is 100% being handcuffed by piss poor coaching and play calling, period. The poor kid doesn't have a chance and his mechanics are regressing because of it, resulting in inaccurate throws. Boo to you, BOO BOO BOO!
these excuses don't make sense to me at least, how does the playcall impact mechanics? Mechanics are on the player not the coaches choice of run or pass.

Maybe you can understand Clay Matthews explanation better?

Clay Matthews on Mitch Trubisky:

“His pocket presence will come along. You have to take advantage of that. That’s exactly what we did. We ended up with five sacks, a number of quarterback pressures and hurries. That’s what you expect to do when a team is so one dimensional."
I don't see anything in there about throwing mechanics. Clay?
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PapaDongo wrote:
Funkster wrote:
PapaDongo wrote:
Funkster wrote:Just stop, Trubisky has shown some rookie mistakes but he also is 100% being handcuffed by piss poor coaching and play calling, period. The poor kid doesn't have a chance and his mechanics are regressing because of it, resulting in inaccurate throws. Boo to you, BOO BOO BOO!
these excuses don't make sense to me at least, how does the playcall impact mechanics? Mechanics are on the player not the coaches choice of run or pass.

Maybe you can understand Clay Matthews explanation better?

Clay Matthews on Mitch Trubisky:

“His pocket presence will come along. You have to take advantage of that. That’s exactly what we did. We ended up with five sacks, a number of quarterback pressures and hurries. That’s what you expect to do when a team is so one dimensional."
I don't see anything in there about throwing mechanics. Clay?
It's, at its absolute best, intentionally obtuse to not acknowledge how the constant pressure he's faced from passing almost exclusively out of obvious passing situations with zero competent wide receivers can affect mechanics.

And that's at its absolute best.
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docc wrote:Might want to judge Trubisky at LEAST after his first offseason..

Dam this is stupid...
Watching the game 60 YEARS..
Many other good/great QBS had way more experience and better support but struggled WAY WORSE than Trubisky..

Think
Docc to the fucking rescue. The play calling is atrocious, the OL has been suspect, the WR's...enough said. But lets blame a rookie QB with 13 college starts? I don't think anybody here is confused with the idea that Trubisky has arrived already, as we all knew he would need time. Fix these other issues, give Trubisky game experience and then see whether he sucks or not.
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docc wrote:Might want to judge Trubisky at LEAST after his first offseason..

Dam this is stupid...
Watching the game 60 YEARS..
Many other good/great QBS had way more experience and better support but struggled WAY WORSE than Trubisky..

Think
you dont have to even go back 60 years!
all you had to do was watch jared goff after a few starts last year vs. what he looks like this year.
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Hematite wrote:
docc wrote:Might want to judge Trubisky at LEAST after his first offseason..

Dam this is stupid...
Watching the game 60 YEARS..
Many other good/great QBS had way more experience and better support but struggled WAY WORSE than Trubisky..

Think
Docc to the fucking rescue. The play calling is atrocious, the OL has been suspect, the WR's...enough said. But lets blame a rookie QB with 13 college starts? I don't think anybody here is confused with the idea that Trubisky has arrived already, as we all knew he would need time. Fix these other issues, give Trubisky game experience and then see whether he sucks or not.
AGREED.

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PapaDongo wrote:
RING4CHI wrote:
PapaDongo wrote:
G08 wrote:Mitch just said on the 5 sacks that some of them were him "protecting the football".

That's awesome, coach the aggressiveness and playmaking out of him.


I fucking hate this team.
I posted about that in another thread and some guy went crazy. Taking sacks to protect the ball is for cucks.
Please. If he threw INTs on those plays instead of taking sacks, that's what your Trubisky hate thread would be about.
I'm not hating on anyone, just being objective. It isn't about love/hate and it's not about sacks/interceptions. If Trubisky thinks taking sacks is a good thing because you at least don't give up the ball, we need a coach to do better with him. I can't believe people have such low expectations for a 2nd pick overall that they are arguing about sacks being better than interceptions.

How about some touchdowns? How about throwing beyond the LOS on third down?
Not just picking on you here, since you're not alone to say this... He's the 2nd overall pick therefore...........

That thinking fails to take into account what the guy actually did in college in preparation to enter the NFL. 13 college starts. That's it. Didn't call plays in the huddle or take snaps from center. Didn't do NFL style reads.

Playing NFL QB is way WAY different from that. By all indications, the plan was to let him sit most or all of his rookie year. Why? Because he wasn't ready.

So they threw him out there when they knew he wasn't fully prepared, because Mike Glennon sucked so badly. And they are dialing back the game plan.

Does that mean he sucks? Possibly. But when you throw the kid out there knowing he's not fully prepared, is that a reflection on him or somebody else???
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I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
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wab wrote:
crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
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RustyTrubisky wrote:
docc wrote:Might want to judge Trubisky at LEAST after his first offseason..

Dam this is stupid...
Watching the game 60 YEARS..
Many other good/great QBS had way more experience and better support but struggled WAY WORSE than Trubisky..

Think
you dont have to even go back 60 years!
all you had to do was watch jared goff after a few starts last year vs. what he looks like this year.
Exactly. Most of us tend to have short memories when the red mist falls.

But I would dare to say that you could put any HOF QB (like Favre, Elway, Manning) in his rookie season behind a makeshift OL, with no starting X and Z receivers, no no 1 or no 2 TE, and a one dimensional gameplan called by conservative coaches, and he would struggle. Before anyone jumps on me, I'm not saying Mitch is a future HOFer. Just that any QB in that situation will struggle in some way.

I get that everyone's hacked off. I am too. Big time. But let's let the red mist blow away, take a breath and give Mitch a break. A lot of colleges operate the spread system these days, and so the step up to an NFL pro style system is bigger. Mitch has only started 5 games.
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Hematite wrote:
wab wrote:
crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
Nope... but know who has been working daily with Alex Smith?

Matt Nagy.
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sigh.

someone doesn't remember life before Cutler.

Chill, give the kid time, Rome was not built in a day. Look at Dak without Elliot yesterday... there is more to a team than a QB... obviously Green Bay knows that now too.
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I think Trubisky's main problem is two-fold IMO.t

1. He has a conservative coach who is handcuffing him and telling him to stick to the play...maybe for good reason, but at some point Fox and Loggains need to just turn him loose and hope he grows from his mistakes on turnovers, instead of the lack of them by eating the ball when he could throw it away or force a ball and try to let his receiver make a play.

2. Nothing in this offense is natural to him yet.

He has to think about all the verbiage; he has to think about keeping his mechanics just right; he has to think about where the receivers are supposed to be in each play and then adjust to where they actually are; he has to think about pressure and protections and he has to think about not making turnovers and trying to gauge when it's OK to take a shot on any given play.

None of this is 2nd nature to him yet, especially given how much he has to worry about playing in the conservative format Fox has dictated.
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Remember how much Ryan Pace was pimping Trubisky's ability to throw the football from a multitude of platforms? Where has that been? Oh, I know! It literally has been coached out of him and has been traded in for tucking his tail between his legs and taking a sack.
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G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
wab wrote:
crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
Nope... but know who has been working daily with Alex Smith?

Matt Nagy.
An Andy Reid disciple with Mitch Trubisky could be a match made in heaven. I'd go balls to the walls if this were to happen!
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G08 wrote:Remember how much Ryan Pace was pimping Trubisky's ability to throw the football from a multitude of platforms? Where has that been? Oh, I know! It literally has been coached out of him and has been traded in for tucking his tail between his legs and taking a sack.
I really think you are overblowing the notion that his skills are being coached out of him. I get it, Fox is conservative, but Trubisky isn't being coached into a pussy. He's doing what he's told. Inherently there isn't really anything wrong with that. When he gets a coach that maximizes his talent, he's not going to be all "well Fox made me take a sack rather than take a chance for 12 games, so I'll probably just keep doing that".
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Hematite wrote:
G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
wab wrote:
crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
Nope... but know who has been working daily with Alex Smith?

Matt Nagy.
An Andy Reid disciple with Mitch Trubisky could be a match made in heaven. I'd go balls to the walls if this were to happen!
It's worth a look, I would think. The guy played the position and has been with Reid for 10 seasons.
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G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
wab wrote:
crueltyabc wrote:I think I’ve been less impressed than a lot of guys on this board but see no reason to believe he will be bad. If it turns out he’s a serviceable game manager type guy, then at least we have a cheap one for a few years while we look to add weapons around him etc. considering how often guys are just straight busts, I’m not complaining


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I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
Nope... but know who has been working daily with Alex Smith?

Matt Nagy.
An Andy Reid disciple with Mitch Trubisky could be a match made in heaven. I'd go balls to the walls if this were to happen!
It's worth a look, I would think. The guy played the position and has been with Reid for 10 seasons.
Good or bad, I see Carmichael Jr. as being more in line with Pace. It's a copycat league and Pace has done nothing to hide his copying of the Saints blueprint. I believe Carmichael Jr. runs a Coryell based offense, whereas Nagy obviously is west coast. With Trubisky's talents and factoring in the weather in Chicago, which system do you all believe would work best here?
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With the way the saints are running the ball and staying somewhat balanced on offense lately, Carmichael is intriguing. I'm just not sure if he's HC material?
“Protect this fucking house, go all out, leave that shit out on the field, let’s have some fun, makes some plays baby ” Mitch Trubisky #believethesleeve
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Atkins&Rebel wrote:I think Trubisky's main problem is two-fold IMO.t

1. He has a conservative coach who is handcuffing him and telling him to stick to the play...maybe for good reason, but at some point Fox and Loggains need to just turn him loose and hope he grows from his mistakes on turnovers, instead of the lack of them by eating the ball when he could throw it away or force a ball and try to let his receiver make a play.

2. Nothing in this offense is natural to him yet.

He has to think about all the verbiage; he has to think about keeping his mechanics just right; he has to think about where the receivers are supposed to be in each play and then adjust to where they actually are; he has to think about pressure and protections and he has to think about not making turnovers and trying to gauge when it's OK to take a shot on any given play.

None of this is 2nd nature to him yet, especially given how much he has to worry about playing in the conservative format Fox has dictated.
Excellent points. I'd add that certain necessary "time" skills just aren't natural to him yet. Like having to get rid of the ball before "thousand five". And processing the pre-snap stuff while keeping an eye on the play clock.
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Hematite wrote:
G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
G08 wrote:
Hematite wrote:
wab wrote: I think you saw him get more comfortable yesterday. He doesn't have great pocket awareness, and you can tell his timing with the merry go round or WR's is off...but I think that will come with experience and a consistent group of weapons. I'm just glad they finally opened it up a bit for him.
He can be our Alex Smith and I would be more than OK with that. But even Alex needed the right coaching to reach his potential. Does anybody really believe this staff can do that for Trubs?
Nope... but know who has been working daily with Alex Smith?

Matt Nagy.
An Andy Reid disciple with Mitch Trubisky could be a match made in heaven. I'd go balls to the walls if this were to happen!
It's worth a look, I would think. The guy played the position and has been with Reid for 10 seasons.
Good or bad, I see Carmichael Jr. as being more in line with Pace. It's a copycat league and Pace has done nothing to hide his copying of the Saints blueprint. I believe Carmichael Jr. runs a Coryell based offense, whereas Nagy obviously is west coast. With Trubisky's talents and factoring in the weather in Chicago, which system do you all believe would work best here?
We've tried both in Chicago... I'd prefer Nagy only because it *should* be similar verbiage and footwork for Trubisky. Payton I don't believe employs the various drops that Martz did when he brought his Coryell system here.
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Nagy? Really? I just don't see him having enough experience as an OC let alone promoting him to a HC.
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1st if all:
Everyone has the right to be potentially salty after a loss, & the title of the post shouldn't be off limits, who knows... Maybe Trib Ain't that good..
(Only Time will tell)

2ndly:
Don't create thoughtlessly controversial, emotionally driven, overreaction posts.
Please.

(This post is CLEARLY all of those things)

Last Point:
Good for you; you got yourself a 6+ thread with your name next to it!
Don't confuse # of responses with popularity.
This isn't the kind of attention that you'll enjoy for long.

I look forward to reading less dumb things from some of you sooner.
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Pagan wrote:1st if all:
Everyone has the right to be potentially salty after a loss, & the title of the post shouldn't be off limits, who knows... Maybe Trib Ain't that good..
(Only Time will tell)

2ndly:
Don't create thoughtlessly controversial, emotionally driven, overreaction posts.
Please.

(This post is CLEARLY all of those things)

Last Point:
Good for you; you got yourself a 6+ thread with your name next to it!
Don't confuse # of responses with popularity.
This isn't the kind of attention that you'll enjoy for long.

I look forward to reading less dumb things from some of you sooner.
Yup.

I really have no problem in what I am seeing. AT ALL.

We are seeing someone develop, and that's a good thing. Pretty sure he could go out there and sling the ball aroundd but what can come of that? A few more TDs mixed in with 2ints a game? Only time will tell with any developing rookie QBs. He may not be "winning games" for the Bears, but he isn't loosing them either. As a fan, I actually look forward to games on sundays now. Not because I expect a win or see anything of greatness of sorts. But I get to watch someone progress, even if it's slow progress. Most of us are not delusional enough to think the Bears are going to win a championship this year. So this is kind of a perfect situation right now where your Potential Franchise QB is gaining a ton of experience without numbers good or bad, but he is still gaining knowledge. He has shown he has the skill so what they are doing with him is good IMO. For the long term.... loosing these games isn't a terrible thing either, the team has shown some things to be happy about. loosing these games stinks a bit but we will get a better draft pick so...

I don't know, my glass is 3/4 full and can give two shits what the negative Nancy's say at this point.
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46Blitz wrote:
Pagan wrote:1st if all:
Everyone has the right to be potentially salty after a loss, & the title of the post shouldn't be off limits, who knows... Maybe Trib Ain't that good..
(Only Time will tell)

2ndly:
Don't create thoughtlessly controversial, emotionally driven, overreaction posts.
Please.

(This post is CLEARLY all of those things)

Last Point:
Good for you; you got yourself a 6+ thread with your name next to it!
Don't confuse # of responses with popularity.
This isn't the kind of attention that you'll enjoy for long.

I look forward to reading less dumb things from some of you sooner.
Yup.

I really have no problem in what I am seeing. AT ALL.

We are seeing someone develop, and that's a good thing. Pretty sure he could go out there and sling the ball aroundd but what can come of that? A few more TDs mixed in with 2ints a game? Only time will tell with any developing rookie QBs. He may not be "winning games" for the Bears, but he isn't loosing them either. As a fan, I actually look forward to games on sundays now. Not because I expect a win or see anything of greatness of sorts. But I get to watch someone progress, even if it's slow progress. Most of us are not delusional enough to think the Bears are going to win a championship this year. So this is kind of a perfect situation right now where your Potential Franchise QB is gaining a ton of experience without numbers good or bad, but he is still gaining knowledge. He has shown he has the skill so what they are doing with him is good IMO. For the long term.... loosing these games isn't a terrible thing either, the team has shown some things to be happy about. loosing these games stinks a bit but we will get a better draft pick so...

I don't know, my glass is 3/4 full and can give two shits what the negative Nancy's say at this point.
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Not really trying to be overly negative and don't really need the lecture on making a thread or posting about a subject to whoever that guy was up above this post that is being super critical, but I do think ya gotta prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

Just saying, Tru might never show anything unless the right stuff is around him. Bears need to get Tru consistency but he can't get anything like that his first year.

Then they fire the coaches? Tru will have a new system to learn. Tru will have to get his mechanics fixed, Tru will have to be coachable by a whole new staff. Then what happens if they don't get results, say it's freaking McDaniels? Now they start to ruin Tru like all the other QBs we've had since Jim Miller.

There are quarterbacks that come in and make wins happen, and there are projects. Tru needs some work.
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PapaDongo wrote:Not really trying to be overly negative and don't really need the lecture on making a thread or posting about a subject to whoever that guy was up above this post that is being super critical, but I do think ya gotta prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

Just saying, Tru might never show anything unless the right stuff is around him. Bears need to get Tru consistency but he can't get anything like that his first year.

Then they fire the coaches? Tru will have a new system to learn. Tru will have to get his mechanics fixed, Tru will have to be coachable by a whole new staff. Then what happens if they don't get results, say it's freaking McDaniels? Now they start to ruin Tru like all the other QBs we've had since Jim Miller.

There are quarterbacks that come in and make wins happen, and there are projects. Tru needs some work.
I agree! Switching to competent offensive coaches has done nothing good for Goff. I'd rather Trubisky hand off every first down and try his hardest to complete 3rd and longs his whole career while under pressure. Because that is the winning formula for developing a QB.
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