UPDATE: Future Head Coaching Options Discussion
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- wab
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I've been pretty lukewarm on Daboll all along and this only further cements it. The Bills offense is waaaaaay too pass-centric and completely relies on Allen.
- Otis Day
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hell with it, give me Dave Toub. He can be head coach. He is not directing either side of the ball. His focus is on the team as a whole, clock management, all the other things game related.
The hot coordinators do not stay hot. Nagy was the hot coordinator......that didn't work out.
I want a guy who can lead the team, not one side of the ball.
The hot coordinators do not stay hot. Nagy was the hot coordinator......that didn't work out.
I want a guy who can lead the team, not one side of the ball.
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You got my vote, Otis. Dave Toub is still in the game and he is well-known to the Bears.Otis Day wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 12:14 pm hell with it, give me Dave Toub. He can be head coach. He is not directing either side of the ball. His focus is on the team as a whole, clock management, all the other things game related.
The hot coordinators do not stay hot. Nagy was the hot coordinator......that didn't work out.
I want a guy who can lead the team, not one side of the ball.
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Who has a clear set of goals
He’s rebuilt his team
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Of winning some more Super Bowls
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I don’t understand the Daboll love when they should be trying to get Ryan Day.
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Harbaugh.
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I liked this piece on him
https://ontapsportsnet.com/2021/11/09/b ... nfl-bears/
Pros:
Shows ability and willingness to adapt his scheme to his quarterback.
Willingness to try new things to put his players in positions to succeed.
Analytically driven play-caller with willingness to learn and evolve.
Development of Josh Allen from a talented but very raw QB to an All-Pro caliber passer.
Network to build a competent staff after 21 years of NFL coaching experience across multiple organizations.
Understanding of both offense and defense having played safety in college and coached on both sides of the football.
Proven himself to be an asset to multiple successful head coaches (Belichick, Saban, McDermott).
Cons:
Unproven as a motivator. Can he energize a locker room and navigate his team through adversity?
The Bill Belichick coaching tree has not shown a track record of success in the NFL. Has he learned enough when away from Belichick and Saban to not repeat the mistakes of their previous disciples?
His first two years in Buffalo were slow to show progress offensively. How long will it take with a new team to see results? Is this due to a complex system, trial and error, or a talent deficit?
Daboll had a quick rise through the coaching ranks, got knocked down, and was slow to get back to this point. After becoming a coordinator in 2009 at 32 years old, he bounced around a few spots before returning as a New England assistant. Will he need to fail before he succeeds more than others?
I'm still interested in him, but his interview and plan to move forward would be key -- his ability to adapt is big, the biggest question mark to me is his ability to lead, which is going to be a question for any first-time HC.
https://ontapsportsnet.com/2021/11/09/b ... nfl-bears/
Pros:
Shows ability and willingness to adapt his scheme to his quarterback.
Willingness to try new things to put his players in positions to succeed.
Analytically driven play-caller with willingness to learn and evolve.
Development of Josh Allen from a talented but very raw QB to an All-Pro caliber passer.
Network to build a competent staff after 21 years of NFL coaching experience across multiple organizations.
Understanding of both offense and defense having played safety in college and coached on both sides of the football.
Proven himself to be an asset to multiple successful head coaches (Belichick, Saban, McDermott).
Cons:
Unproven as a motivator. Can he energize a locker room and navigate his team through adversity?
The Bill Belichick coaching tree has not shown a track record of success in the NFL. Has he learned enough when away from Belichick and Saban to not repeat the mistakes of their previous disciples?
His first two years in Buffalo were slow to show progress offensively. How long will it take with a new team to see results? Is this due to a complex system, trial and error, or a talent deficit?
Daboll had a quick rise through the coaching ranks, got knocked down, and was slow to get back to this point. After becoming a coordinator in 2009 at 32 years old, he bounced around a few spots before returning as a New England assistant. Will he need to fail before he succeeds more than others?
I'm still interested in him, but his interview and plan to move forward would be key -- his ability to adapt is big, the biggest question mark to me is his ability to lead, which is going to be a question for any first-time HC.
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Bowles is still my guy.
- IE
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I like Leftwich. It isn't just the success with Brady. Although Brady has raved about him (and he's younger than Brady). It is Arians' opinion, reliance on & promotion of him.
From wiki:
From wiki:
Pre-Brady, Leftwich in his first year had the offense humming with Jameis (Byron didn't throw the INTs). JF1 is like a new & improved version of Winston ("now with ball protection and better decisions!"). I think he'd be really good with the Bears.Tampa Bay Buccaneers
On January 8, 2019, Leftwich was hired by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers as their offensive coordinator, reuniting with head coach Bruce Arians.[31] Arians, who was returning from retirement, said in an interview with ESPN that he "wouldn't have taken the job if it wasn't for general manager Jason Licht, and probably wouldn't have taken the job if Byron Leftwich wasn't available."[32]
After the 2020 regular season, Arians stated that he had delegated the offense to Leftwich, and expressed frustration that the coordinator was not interviewed by other NFL teams for a head coaching position.[33][34] At the end of that season, their second with Arians and Leftwich, the Buccaneers won Super Bowl LV.
Last edited by IE on Tue Nov 23, 2021 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I still like Kellen Moore but he is totally unproven.
The bears is not a place to learn how to be a HC.
We need someone who we know can do the job.
The bears is not a place to learn how to be a HC.
We need someone who we know can do the job.
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- wab
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Yes. I'm generally not a fan of re-treads, but in this case I think the situation calls for it. That's why I like Bowles. Good coach that is respected by his players. Just in the wrong place at the wrong time in AZ.Ditka’s dictaphone wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:21 pm I still like Kellen Moore but he is totally unproven.
The bears is not a place to learn how to be a HC.
We need someone who we know can do the job.
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I wouldn't be against Bowles at all. I think my question would be who comes in to reshape the offense with himwab wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:23 pmYes. I'm generally not a fan of re-treads, but in this case I think the situation calls for it. That's why I like Bowles. Good coach that is respected by his players. Just in the wrong place at the wrong time in AZ.Ditka’s dictaphone wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:21 pm I still like Kellen Moore but he is totally unproven.
The bears is not a place to learn how to be a HC.
We need someone who we know can do the job.
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I don't like the Daboll and Roman ideas because I don't think the analogy to their QBs is right.
I like the Leftwich, Moore, and Day ideas for Fields. I'm good with Bowles but don't know who he could bring at OC that would make me feel confident. Is there a hotshot QB coach somewhere looking for a promotion?
I also like the idea of Desai sticking around for continuity. I believe that the Bears would have a top 10 defense if only they had 3 league average CBs
I like the Leftwich, Moore, and Day ideas for Fields. I'm good with Bowles but don't know who he could bring at OC that would make me feel confident. Is there a hotshot QB coach somewhere looking for a promotion?
I also like the idea of Desai sticking around for continuity. I believe that the Bears would have a top 10 defense if only they had 3 league average CBs
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If the direction is a defensive coordinator and experienced guy, I'd love to see Les Frazier come home.
Also it isn't unprecedented for teams to trade for coaches. Bears don't have draft picks but how about approaching WFT with a Mack for Chico deal? Chico's always been my guy.
But offensively, my preference is Leftwich and then Moore and then Day. I really like Day but NFL is so different from college...
I know people like Harbaugh as an ex Bear, and he's been having some success after a lot of failure (according to MI standards). He hasn't beaten Day though. He's had some success at the NFL level but that really has to be attributed to Vic Fangio and Ed Donatell - who brought a Matt Nagy team to the playoffs. Maybe he's better than he used to be - but he's SO odd and so coachy it can get cringy. I do have to admit there's a little Pete Carrol-ish vibe from Harbaugh. I wouldn't be mad if he was the choice.
Also it isn't unprecedented for teams to trade for coaches. Bears don't have draft picks but how about approaching WFT with a Mack for Chico deal? Chico's always been my guy.
But offensively, my preference is Leftwich and then Moore and then Day. I really like Day but NFL is so different from college...
I know people like Harbaugh as an ex Bear, and he's been having some success after a lot of failure (according to MI standards). He hasn't beaten Day though. He's had some success at the NFL level but that really has to be attributed to Vic Fangio and Ed Donatell - who brought a Matt Nagy team to the playoffs. Maybe he's better than he used to be - but he's SO odd and so coachy it can get cringy. I do have to admit there's a little Pete Carrol-ish vibe from Harbaugh. I wouldn't be mad if he was the choice.
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Greg Roman. I'd take strong looks at Toub and Todd Bowles. Too few college guys can successfully make the jump to the pros to take a swing at Ryan Day or Lincoln Riley.
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The coach won’t matter if you still have an incompetent GM constantly falling in love with busts and trading up for them, and then overpaying free agents to make up for his draft mistakes.
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I just do not want a college guy here. The odds that it works are pretty slim. I know Fields is the future, but bringing in a guy just for one player, little leery about that. The team just needs COMPETENT PEOPLE!!!!
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Andy Reid was very complimentary about Matt Nagy too...IE wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:15 pm I like Leftwich. It isn't just the success with Brady. Although Brady has raved about him (and he's younger than Brady). It is Arians' opinion, reliance on & promotion of him.
From wiki:Pre-Brady, Leftwich in his first year had the offense humming with Jameis (Byron didn't throw the INTs). JF1 is like a new & improved version of Winston ("now with ball protection and better decisions!"). I think he'd be really good with the Bears.Tampa Bay Buccaneers
On January 8, 2019, Leftwich was hired by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers as their offensive coordinator, reuniting with head coach Bruce Arians.[31] Arians, who was returning from retirement, said in an interview with ESPN that he "wouldn't have taken the job if it wasn't for general manager Jason Licht, and probably wouldn't have taken the job if Byron Leftwich wasn't available."[32]
After the 2020 regular season, Arians stated that he had delegated the offense to Leftwich, and expressed frustration that the coordinator was not interviewed by other NFL teams for a head coaching position.[33][34] At the end of that season, their second with Arians and Leftwich, the Buccaneers won Super Bowl LV.
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Yea I don’t want Leftwich
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I don’t see Harbaugh leaving Michigan..
Zero interest in Leftwich unless Brady is coming with..
My top choice is Kyle Shanahan but I don’t think he gets let go..
Anyone know anything about Matt Campbell from Iowa State?
Is Doug Peterson an option?
Zero interest in Leftwich unless Brady is coming with..
My top choice is Kyle Shanahan but I don’t think he gets let go..
Anyone know anything about Matt Campbell from Iowa State?
Is Doug Peterson an option?
- IE
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Maybe - but Nagy hadn't done anything. This is not even close to an analogy. Reid never said he turned over the offense completely to Nagy. As a matter of fact he only "let" him call a handful of games. Imagine Reid saying he wouldn't take a job if Nagy wasn't with him (lol).HisRoyalSweetness wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:19 pmAndy Reid was very complimentary about Matt Nagy too...IE wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:15 pm I like Leftwich. It isn't just the success with Brady. Although Brady has raved about him (and he's younger than Brady). It is Arians' opinion, reliance on & promotion of him.
From wiki:
Pre-Brady, Leftwich in his first year had the offense humming with Jameis (Byron didn't throw the INTs). JF1 is like a new & improved version of Winston ("now with ball protection and better decisions!"). I think he'd be really good with the Bears.
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Reid said out of all of his assistants Nagy was the most prepared to be a head coach.IE wrote: ↑Wed Nov 24, 2021 8:27 amMaybe - but Nagy hadn't done anything. This is not even close to an analogy. Reid never said he turned over the offense completely to Nagy. As a matter of fact he only "let" him call a handful of games. Imagine Reid saying he wouldn't take a job if Nagy wasn't with him (lol).HisRoyalSweetness wrote: ↑Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:19 pm
Andy Reid was very complimentary about Matt Nagy too...
All head coaches will speak effusively about their assistants when they’re up for jobs and so what they say should be taken with a grain of salt.
I don’t care what Arians says, Tampa Bay’s offense would repeatedly shoot itself in the foot (sound familiar?) until Brady got there.
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I like him a lot, ditto on his first go round, but who is his offensive coordinator?
And do we risk continuing to shuttle OCs in and out on almost a yearly basis?
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Ryan Day makes the most sense to me, but why would he leave a pretty cush job at Ohio State?
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You mean Jameis. Their offense was pretty good and put up good numbers with lesser players prior to Brady.TheWorldBreaker wrote: ↑Wed Nov 24, 2021 11:35 amReid said out of all of his assistants Nagy was the most prepared to be a head coach.IE wrote: ↑Wed Nov 24, 2021 8:27 am
Maybe - but Nagy hadn't done anything. This is not even close to an analogy. Reid never said he turned over the offense completely to Nagy. As a matter of fact he only "let" him call a handful of games. Imagine Reid saying he wouldn't take a job if Nagy wasn't with him (lol).
All head coaches will speak effusively about their assistants when they’re up for jobs and so what they say should be taken with a grain of salt.
I don’t care what Arians says, Tampa Bay’s offense would repeatedly shoot itself in the foot (sound familiar?) until Brady got there.
I don't remember the Reid quote. But again - what is said is different than what is actually done. Byron's been running the Tampa offense for 3 years, and independently for the last 2. And he's earned Brady's respect. I see zero analogy beyond the superficial "all coaches say..."
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To answer the original question, I'm a little cooler on Daboll than a month ago. I thought he could be a steal and help the Bears O join the 21st century. Buffalo is loaded with talent on O yet they're struggling. Don't know if defenses have caught up to them or not, but not maintaining a strong running attack is probably hurting them.
And for Harbaugh's availability, let's see what happens against OSU. If he can't deliver a W this year he may be shown the door.
I'd rather see a ST coordinator who has been in the league awhile rise up to HC for the Bears. Like Toub. The key will be finding a good OC and DC. He may be able to lure some with them knowing he won't be second-guessing them or pulling the rug out from him as a HC who was formerly an OC or DC. It's part of the reason why Chico left as Lubby tried to overshadow him. Notice how the D struggled after 2005?
And for Harbaugh's availability, let's see what happens against OSU. If he can't deliver a W this year he may be shown the door.
I'd rather see a ST coordinator who has been in the league awhile rise up to HC for the Bears. Like Toub. The key will be finding a good OC and DC. He may be able to lure some with them knowing he won't be second-guessing them or pulling the rug out from him as a HC who was formerly an OC or DC. It's part of the reason why Chico left as Lubby tried to overshadow him. Notice how the D struggled after 2005?
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It put up good numbers until the QB made critical mistakes that cost them and they couldn’t coach that out of him.IE wrote: ↑Wed Nov 24, 2021 12:30 pmYou mean Jameis. Their offense was pretty good and put up good numbers with lesser players prior to Brady.TheWorldBreaker wrote: ↑Wed Nov 24, 2021 11:35 am
Reid said out of all of his assistants Nagy was the most prepared to be a head coach.
All head coaches will speak effusively about their assistants when they’re up for jobs and so what they say should be taken with a grain of salt.
I don’t care what Arians says, Tampa Bay’s offense would repeatedly shoot itself in the foot (sound familiar?) until Brady got there.
I don't remember the Reid quote. But again - what is said is different than what is actually done. Byron's been running the Tampa offense for 3 years, and independently for the last 2. And he's earned Brady's respect. I see zero analogy beyond the superficial "all coaches say..."
Justin Fields is a QB that makes dumb mistakes every game (he literally got injured because he ran instead of throwing the check down) and needs that coached out of him.
But there is no evidence he can coach up a young player into being better player—The Tampa offense didn’t take off and become elite until the greatest QB of all time showed up.
Tom Brady is not coming with him.