Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

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BR0D1E86
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Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:15 am

Some good Jordan Howard stats in here. I remember many of us wondering why we refused to use the shotgun this season, especially since we used it so frequently and were relatively successful out of it the year before...

https://sportsmockery.com/2018/01/peopl ... an-howard/
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:34 am

BR0D1E86 wrote:Some good Jordan Howard stats in here. I remember many of us wondering why we refused to use the shotgun this season, especially since we used it so frequently and were relatively successful out of it the year before...

https://sportsmockery.com/2018/01/peopl ... an-howard/
I mean, this, this, this;
In other words Howard has averaged a whopping 6.05 yards per carry running out of the shotgun formation. The fact the Bears only did it 35 times in 2017 despite having a mobile QB like Trubisky for 12 of those games? That’s criminal negligence.
It just further solidifies the possibility of a complete offensive turnaround for 2018.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:12 am

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
BR0D1E86 wrote:Some good Jordan Howard stats in here. I remember many of us wondering why we refused to use the shotgun this season, especially since we used it so frequently and were relatively successful out of it the year before...

https://sportsmockery.com/2018/01/peopl ... an-howard/
I mean, this, this, this;
In other words Howard has averaged a whopping 6.05 yards per carry running out of the shotgun formation. The fact the Bears only did it 35 times in 2017 despite having a mobile QB like Trubisky for 12 of those games? That’s criminal negligence.
It just further solidifies the possibility of a complete offensive turnaround for 2018.
It's irrelevant now but I'm still completely baffled by this turnaround. No change in HC or OC, we draft a QB that would likely operate well out of the gun and we just stop using it. The only thing that would make any sense is Pace issuing a pretty strong message that he wanted Trubisky to lean how to play under centre but that seems like a massive stretch.
"I wouldn't take him for a conditional 7th. His next contract will pay him more than he could possibly contribute.".

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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:18 am

malk wrote:
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
BR0D1E86 wrote:Some good Jordan Howard stats in here. I remember many of us wondering why we refused to use the shotgun this season, especially since we used it so frequently and were relatively successful out of it the year before...

https://sportsmockery.com/2018/01/peopl ... an-howard/
I mean, this, this, this;
In other words Howard has averaged a whopping 6.05 yards per carry running out of the shotgun formation. The fact the Bears only did it 35 times in 2017 despite having a mobile QB like Trubisky for 12 of those games? That’s criminal negligence.
It just further solidifies the possibility of a complete offensive turnaround for 2018.
It's irrelevant now but I'm still completely baffled by this turnaround. No change in HC or OC, we draft a QB that would likely operate well out of the gun and we just stop using it. The only thing that would make any sense is Pace issuing a pretty strong message that he wanted Trubisky to lean how to play under centre but that seems like a massive stretch.
Not a massive stretch at all. I have no doubt that part of this last year was focused on the development of Trubisky. Granted they should have gone to that shotgun play more often. But a large portion of his play this year was getting experience playing under center. Now, we won't see much of it with Nagy/Hellfrich, but Biscuits didn't do it at all in NC, and needed to learn how in the NFL.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:59 am

For as much as we bagged on Loggains and friends last season, I thought they did a heck of a job developing Trubisky. It was night-and-day compared to his first couple starts in the league. Solid base with which to work next season.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jan 22, 2018 10:01 am

I think Loggians could teach fundamentals and a pretty good "coach" but he couldn't scheme worth a shit.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:06 pm

I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.

The worry I have with the Howard/Cohen dynamic is tipping our hand.

Kareem Hunt played 64.75% of the Chiefs' offensive snaps (665 snaps), rushed the ball 272 times and was targeted 63 times in the passing game. So roughly 50% of the time he was on the field he was either rushing the ball or had a pass go his way.

Tyreek Hill played 75.56% of their snaps and had 122 combined looks. 18.34% of the time he was on the field he had the ball go his way.

That mix, I presume, is going to be different for Howard/Cohen. I honestly think that Howard is going to get a bulk of the carries, and Cohen is going to have a hybrid WR/RB role for us next season. Otherwise, you're tipping your hand way too much for my taste.

I'm anticipating a lot of shotgun, single back looks with Cohen outside or in the slot. RPOs with some ghost jet action from Cohen (sprinkled in with some reverses to keep defenses honest) and Howard punishing defenders on inside/outside zone.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:27 pm

i think it's entirely possible that Cohen spends most of his time at WR.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:34 pm

wab wrote:i think it's entirely possible that Cohen spends most of his time at WR.
Wouldn't shock me one single bit, man. Kid ran solid routes for someone that hardly played the position in college. Plus, dude has HUGE mitts.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:38 pm

Shaheen and Cohen being better utilised, or just better after their rookie years, could really unlock this offence for Nagy.

With Cohen I agree that it needs to be via him being out wide or in the slot. It's not mainly the touches but the yards per reception that need need to go up. His routes are nice so I'm looking forward to seeing how we can scheme that minimises his height being an issue. Minimises his height. Lol.

For Shaheen it's just about those touches! 12 receptions on 14 targets means get that kid more targets. Bin off Sims, make this kid a feature, and see if he steps up to the mark.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:44 pm

wab wrote:i think it's entirely possible that Cohen spends most of his time at WR.
I bet that happened this year, but should even more next year. How you play a guy like Cohen is an interesting game, especially when you have a Jordan Howard. I think the possibilities magnify when you have both guys on the field at once. They can really do a lot of things with Cohen and it will be fascinating to see what Helfrich and Nagy come up with.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:40 pm

Mikefive wrote:
wab wrote:i think it's entirely possible that Cohen spends most of his time at WR.
I bet that happened this year, but should even more next year. How you play a guy like Cohen is an interesting game, especially when you have a Jordan Howard. I think the possibilities magnify when you have both guys on the field at once. They can really do a lot of things with Cohen and it will be fascinating to see what Helfrich and Nagy come up with.
An abundance of jet sweeps would be nice, especially with the rpo.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:10 pm

Bit off topic and not to flog a dead horse but... did anyone check out how Deonte Thompson's season turned out. For Buffalo his catch % dropped off a little from his career average but he caught 25 of 25 "catchable" balls going into week 17 and had zero drops all year for them.

His final stats ended up almost identical to Albert Wilson's. Cutting him does look like a bit of a mistake!
"I wouldn't take him for a conditional 7th. His next contract will pay him more than he could possibly contribute.".

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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:13 pm

malk wrote:Bit off topic and not to flog a dead horse but... did anyone check out how Deonte Thompson's season turned out. For Buffalo his catch % dropped off a little from his career average but he caught 25 of 25 "catchable" balls going into week 17 and had zero drops all year for them.

His final stats ended up almost identical to Albert Wilson's. Cutting him does look like a bit of a mistake!
I was pissed off when we let him go. I thought he was ascending and really wanted to see what he could do with MT10. Oh well.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:36 pm

I never thought Deonte Thompson was a performance cut. I always assumed something else happened in house, and they decided to cut ties.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:51 pm

Mikefive wrote:How you play a guy like Cohen is an interesting game, especially when you have a Jordan Howard. I think the possibilities magnify when you have both guys on the field at once. They can really do a lot of things with Cohen and it will be fascinating to see what Helfrich and Nagy come up with.
2 TE, 2 RB 1 WR sets... (multiple pass and common run plays to go with some gems below)
-Split both TE's out left with Jordan and Cohen in the backfield and WR right:
=Quick snap Cohen Sweep R with Howard leading
=Motion Jordan out left, playaction Cohen right, screen pass left to Howard with both TE's out blocking;
=Motion Cohen out left, fake pitch R with Cohen coming back under for a shovel pass;
=Motion Cohen out right to stack behind WR (lots of mis-matches on this formation)
=Playaction both right up the middle with TE's running a double slant and WR running a fade
=Motion Cohen out left, fake screen, delay draw up the middle with Howard
=Line up, quick snap fake Cohen sweep with Howard leading, screen pass to TE coming under
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:15 pm

G08 wrote:
malk wrote:Bit off topic and not to flog a dead horse but... did anyone check out how Deonte Thompson's season turned out. For Buffalo his catch % dropped off a little from his career average but he caught 25 of 25 "catchable" balls going into week 17 and had zero drops all year for them.

His final stats ended up almost identical to Albert Wilson's. Cutting him does look like a bit of a mistake!
I was pissed off when we let him go. I thought he was ascending and really wanted to see what he could do with MT10. Oh well.
So was I. He really developed a nice chemistry with Biscuits in the preseason.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:35 pm

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
G08 wrote:
malk wrote:Bit off topic and not to flog a dead horse but... did anyone check out how Deonte Thompson's season turned out. For Buffalo his catch % dropped off a little from his career average but he caught 25 of 25 "catchable" balls going into week 17 and had zero drops all year for them.

His final stats ended up almost identical to Albert Wilson's. Cutting him does look like a bit of a mistake!
I was pissed off when we let him go. I thought he was ascending and really wanted to see what he could do with MT10. Oh well.
So was I. He really developed a nice chemistry with Biscuits in the preseason.
The Fox regime must not have been in favor of the whole QB chemistry thing. Look what they did (or didn't do actually) with Shaheen.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:03 pm

The Marshall Plan wrote:
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
G08 wrote:
malk wrote:Bit off topic and not to flog a dead horse but... did anyone check out how Deonte Thompson's season turned out. For Buffalo his catch % dropped off a little from his career average but he caught 25 of 25 "catchable" balls going into week 17 and had zero drops all year for them.

His final stats ended up almost identical to Albert Wilson's. Cutting him does look like a bit of a mistake!
I was pissed off when we let him go. I thought he was ascending and really wanted to see what he could do with MT10. Oh well.
So was I. He really developed a nice chemistry with Biscuits in the preseason.
The Fox regime must not have been in favor of the whole QB chemistry thing. Look what they did (or didn't do actually) with Shaheen.
Shaheen's fault was that he was a rookie. According to Fox, rookies don't know how to play football.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:06 pm

staleystarch wrote:
Mikefive wrote:
wab wrote:i think it's entirely possible that Cohen spends most of his time at WR.
I bet that happened this year, but should even more next year. How you play a guy like Cohen is an interesting game, especially when you have a Jordan Howard. I think the possibilities magnify when you have both guys on the field at once. They can really do a lot of things with Cohen and it will be fascinating to see what Helfrich and Nagy come up with.
An abundance of jet sweeps would be nice, especially with the rpo.
Yes. I would like to see a lot of 12 personnel. Start with 2 TE and 2 RB. My guess is that Nagy/Hellfrich is going to use Shaheen as a Travis Kelce. Big TE that is more of a big WR than a TE. He will shift the offense around a lot before the snap to get the defense to give up key information. He'll motion Cohen out of the backfield, or he'll motion Shaheen out of the TE spot to the slot.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:05 am

Cohen and Hill are different players. Hill was primarily a sprinter so they moved him to basically a pure wide receiver last season. Cohen is a natural running back and taking handoffs so it makes the most sense to still use Cohen as a change of pace tailback to Howard, which will make his usage different from Hill.

In addition to spelling Howard at tailback I think the base offense is going to be Howard, 2 WR hopefully with deep speed to keep the field spread, and them moving Shaheen and Cohen all over the formation. You take advantage of Shaheen having the size to play on the line of scrimmage, but also being able to split out. The key player is Cohen. Cohen is not going to become an outside receiver like Hill, but ideally he does need to master the craft of being a traditional slot receiver. You want to be able to run a traditional 11 personnel offense with Cohen as a slot receiver and then be able to motion to all of the RPO stuff, or vice versa. The Bears started Cohen on this journey last season. He was the only running back to take part in WR drills in training camp.

Hopefully they can also develop Taquan Mizzell as a competent 3rd down back. Someone who is a bigger than Cohen to pick up blitzes, but can also potentially be more of a threat when split out as a receiver than someone like Cunningham. Potentially they could do some things in combination with Cohen on the field as well if they can get into manageable 3rd down distances. Split both out, put both in the backfield, or motion one out then the other in to get one of them isolated against a LB.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:16 am

G08 wrote:I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.
Per Adam Jahns of The Athletic, Shaheen has lost 7 lbs :)
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:20 pm

G08 wrote:
G08 wrote:I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.
Per Adam Jahns of The Athletic, Shaheen has lost 7 lbs :)
Per the john, that just means he took a dump.
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:48 am

G08 wrote:
G08 wrote:I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.
Per Adam Jahns of The Athletic, Shaheen has lost 7 lbs :)
I still think his optimal weight is somewhere in the 250 range, but I'm trying to get away from the physical measurables stuff that I'm constantly hung up on.



*Charles Leno is still 6'3 and too small to play tackle for an extended period of time
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:50 am

wab wrote:
G08 wrote:
G08 wrote:I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.
Per Adam Jahns of The Athletic, Shaheen has lost 7 lbs :)
I still think his optimal weight is somewhere in the 250 range, but I'm trying to get away from the physical measurables stuff that I'm constantly hung up on.



*Charles Leno is still 6'3 and too small to play tackle for an extended period of time
Now just hold on their cowboy...I see you have found a new "out" in your praise for the Chicago Bears starting LT. "For an extended period of time?" How extended? By that criteria Joe Thomas was too big to play LT for an extended period of time. Maybe if he was 6'4" and 300lbs, he could have played for 13 years instead of 11.

G08, can we get a ruling on this??
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Re: Official: Mark Helfrich named Bears OC

Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:26 am

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
wab wrote:
G08 wrote:
G08 wrote:I've been a broken record with this but I want Shaheen to cut weight down to about 260 lbs, I think that's going to unlock some speed and balance for the kid.
Per Adam Jahns of The Athletic, Shaheen has lost 7 lbs :)
I still think his optimal weight is somewhere in the 250 range, but I'm trying to get away from the physical measurables stuff that I'm constantly hung up on.



*Charles Leno is still 6'3 and too small to play tackle for an extended period of time
Now just hold on their cowboy...I see you have found a new "out" in your praise for the Chicago Bears starting LT. "For an extended period of time?" How extended? By that criteria Joe Thomas was too big to play LT for an extended period of time. Maybe if he was 6'4" and 300lbs, he could have played for 13 years instead of 11.

G08, can we get a ruling on this??
Absolutely!

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