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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:39 pm 
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I agree it is impossible to ever quantify how much Daniels may or may not have added to Mitch's development. However how many of the great QB's attributed their success to that veteran QB who helped teach them the ropes. ? Opposed to how many times they attributed their success to their Head Coach, Offensive Coordinator or Quarterback Coach. I think the veteran QB mentoring they young QB is a myth. I can see the value in having a backup familiar with the system, so if they need to jump in they can. But there's no upside to Daniels, I'd rather see a guy with the chance of having some upside get snaps. Then you can possiblily trade them ala Garoppolo.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:58 pm 
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Rakshir wrote:
I agree it is impossible to ever quantify how much Daniels may or may not have added to Mitch's development. However how many of the great QB's attributed their success to that veteran QB who helped teach them the ropes. ? Opposed to how many times they attributed their success to their Head Coach, Offensive Coordinator or Quarterback Coach. I think the veteran QB mentoring they young QB is a myth. I can see the value in having a backup familiar with the system, so if they need to jump in they can. But there's no upside to Daniels, I'd rather see a guy with the chance of having some upside get snaps. Then you can possiblily trade them ala Garoppolo.


I believe Mitch has been quoted at least twice saying that he believes that Chase has been a huge help in transitioning from last years offense to Nagys QB intensive system.

Chase himself regularly states that his 1st job is helping the starter be prepared for the next game.

I DO agree with you that, as in many positions, players are generally unlikely to truly train their competitors to take their jobs.

I feel like Pace & Nagy are finding/coaching players who are great leaders & I suspect there are quite a few vets training up the younger players here.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:58 am 
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I think it kind of depends on the situation. Here w/not just a rookie/young qb, but a highly inexperienced one he probably needs more help from a vet, not just in how to play, but how to prepare. And remember coaches b/c of the cba only have so much time w/the players now, having a vet qb mentor probably helps more then it might have in past years.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:38 pm 
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KhalilSackDaddy wrote:
... And remember coaches b/c of the cba only have so much time w/the players now, having a vet qb mentor probably helps more then it might have in past years.
I hadn't considered this angle. Excellent point!


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:23 am 
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Pagan wrote:
Rakshir wrote:
I agree it is impossible to ever quantify how much Daniels may or may not have added to Mitch's development. However how many of the great QB's attributed their success to that veteran QB who helped teach them the ropes. ? Opposed to how many times they attributed their success to their Head Coach, Offensive Coordinator or Quarterback Coach. I think the veteran QB mentoring they young QB is a myth. I can see the value in having a backup familiar with the system, so if they need to jump in they can. But there's no upside to Daniels, I'd rather see a guy with the chance of having some upside get snaps. Then you can possiblily trade them ala Garoppolo.


I believe Mitch has been quoted at least twice saying that he believes that Chase has been a huge help in transitioning from last years offense to Nagys QB intensive system.

Chase himself regularly states that his 1st job is helping the starter be prepared for the next game.

I DO agree with you that, as in many positions, players are generally unlikely to truly train their competitors to take their jobs.

I feel like Pace & Nagy are finding/coaching players who are great leaders & I suspect there are quite a few vets training up the younger players here.
I'm not saying you're right or wrong, because I don't know. But can you imagine Mitch saying... "Nah, Chase doesn't work with me much" or Chase saying "I have enough to learn in our offense and don't have time to babysit Mitch. He's a big boy." ????

Point is, talk is really, really cheap when guys are saying what the team wants them to say. Now that doesn't mean that you're wrong in any way, just that their words to that effect really shouldn't count as evidence.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:36 pm 
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Mikefive wrote:
Pagan wrote:
Rakshir wrote:
I agree it is impossible to ever quantify how much Daniels may or may not have added to Mitch's development. However how many of the great QB's attributed their success to that veteran QB who helped teach them the ropes. ? Opposed to how many times they attributed their success to their Head Coach, Offensive Coordinator or Quarterback Coach. I think the veteran QB mentoring they young QB is a myth. I can see the value in having a backup familiar with the system, so if they need to jump in they can. But there's no upside to Daniels, I'd rather see a guy with the chance of having some upside get snaps. Then you can possiblily trade them ala Garoppolo.


I believe Mitch has been quoted at least twice saying that he believes that Chase has been a huge help in transitioning from last years offense to Nagys QB intensive system.

Chase himself regularly states that his 1st job is helping the starter be prepared for the next game.

I DO agree with you that, as in many positions, players are generally unlikely to truly train their competitors to take their jobs.

I feel like Pace & Nagy are finding/coaching players who are great leaders & I suspect there are quite a few vets training up the younger players here.
I'm not saying you're right or wrong, because I don't know. But can you imagine Mitch saying... "Nah, Chase doesn't work with me much" or Chase saying "I have enough to learn in our offense and don't have time to babysit Mitch. He's a big boy." ????

Point is, talk is really, really cheap when guys are saying what the team wants them to say. Now that doesn't mean that you're wrong in any way, just that their words to that effect really shouldn't count as evidence.


Totally agree.
Talk IS cheap.
100%.

Which is why, when it comes to all problem solving, I never just state an opinion.
It has to go through filters 1st.

My opinion Recipe:
I always take all of the garbage I hear, add it to the things I've seen, mix that stuff real good with what I've learned in life.... sprinkle on a dash of critical thinking..

& presto~ChangO = Educated opinion/correct observation discovered!

It's like magic really.
Only better.
Cuz it uses higher reasoning skills & observable facts.

* * *

It's not that a 2 sentenced point containing a old favorite platitude like "Talk is cheap" is without any value... it's simply not as valuable as problem solving that uses a proper filter or 2.

I guess you can say.. ^^these^^ kinds of opinions are a recipe...
for disaster!
(See what I did there?)

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:23 pm 
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In fairness, I left the door open for a) that it might be true (or might not)… you just don't know, and b) non-verbal evidence, such as seeing those two having sideline discussions when the defense is on the field which we have indeed seen.


:-)

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:26 pm 
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sturf wrote:
It still is the most amazing sequence of events. First, Ryan Pace stayed disciplined and didn't chase a weak pass rusher market both in free agency and the draft even though it became the biggest hole on the team. He stayed committed to that all the way through training camp never even taking a flyer on a guy. Right or wrong Pace was clearly prepared to go into the season with Floyd in a cast and Lynch having not practiced all training camp.

Then somehow Mack comes available who is not only an elite pass rusher and player, but exactly the ideal type of pass rusher and player that the Bears needed in a power OLB to play opposite Floyd's versatility. The absolutely perfect player to fill that giant hole Pace had left on the roster. A hole Pace suddenly filled using all of that saved cap space and draft capital.
Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner.

Pace is officially "The Man."


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:39 pm 
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IotaNet wrote:
sturf wrote:
It still is the most amazing sequence of events. First, Ryan Pace stayed disciplined and didn't chase a weak pass rusher market both in free agency and the draft even though it became the biggest hole on the team. He stayed committed to that all the way through training camp never even taking a flyer on a guy. Right or wrong Pace was clearly prepared to go into the season with Floyd in a cast and Lynch having not practiced all training camp.

Then somehow Mack comes available who is not only an elite pass rusher and player, but exactly the ideal type of pass rusher and player that the Bears needed in a power OLB to play opposite Floyd's versatility. The absolutely perfect player to fill that giant hole Pace had left on the roster. A hole Pace suddenly filled using all of that saved cap space and draft capital.
Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner.

Pace is officially "The Man."
Minor quibble in that Pace did "take a flier" on Aaron Lynch, albeit a not very expensive one.

On your description of Mack, one thing that is underappreciated in the media is that he is a TREMENDOUS person, worker and leader, traits which carry exceptional value with Pace and the McCaskey organization. And as you said, Pace hit a grand slam there.

Along with Nagy being coach of the year, Ryan Pace wins executive of the year. Not sure I'm sticking my neck out so far on this one. But I'm calling it right here right now. :)

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Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm 
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Mikefive wrote:
IotaNet wrote:
sturf wrote:
It still is the most amazing sequence of events. First, Ryan Pace stayed disciplined and didn't chase a weak pass rusher market both in free agency and the draft even though it became the biggest hole on the team. He stayed committed to that all the way through training camp never even taking a flyer on a guy. Right or wrong Pace was clearly prepared to go into the season with Floyd in a cast and Lynch having not practiced all training camp.

Then somehow Mack comes available who is not only an elite pass rusher and player, but exactly the ideal type of pass rusher and player that the Bears needed in a power OLB to play opposite Floyd's versatility. The absolutely perfect player to fill that giant hole Pace had left on the roster. A hole Pace suddenly filled using all of that saved cap space and draft capital.
Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner.

Pace is officially "The Man."
Minor quibble in that Pace did "take a flier" on Aaron Lynch, albeit a not very expensive one.

On your description of Mack, one thing that is underappreciated in the media is that he is a TREMENDOUS person, worker and leader, traits which carry exceptional value with Pace and the McCaskey organization. And as you said, Pace hit a grand slam there.

Along with Nagy being coach of the year, Ryan Pace wins executive of the year. Not sure I'm sticking my neck out so far on this one. But I'm calling it right here right now. :)


My memory could be wrong, but im pretty sure i had Nagy as coach of the year and pace as executive of the year in my 13-3 prediction in the season prediction thread. Just sayin :D


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