G08 wrote:malk wrote:G08 wrote:I think Daniel's greatest impact on this team is "tutoring" Trubisky. Let's not make this more than what it is.
That's fine until Amos is wearing another jersey because Trubisky got another $7m of coaching in addition to Nagy, Helfrich, Ragone...
We can cut him for $3M of dead cap space after this season.
And all the dead cap adds up to good players leaving in free agency. The Saints are a prime example of this and given Pace's express love for how they operate, I worry about it! This year we've got $14,949,222 in dead cap space, of course this can't be reduced to zero but it really shouldn't be that high.
UOK wrote:There's no doubt about Glennon. You'll never get a single argument from me about that. It wasn't a horrible deal to get out of, but it was probably on the surface the worst contract in Bears history.
This is where we disagree, it was a horrible deal to get out of, $16m is a lot of cap space and will materially effect our roster in future. We will lose someone we don't want to in free agency because of this.
wab wrote:malk wrote:G08 wrote:I think Daniel's greatest impact on this team is "tutoring" Trubisky. Let's not make this more than what it is.
That's fine until Amos is wearing another jersey because Trubisky got another $7m of coaching in addition to Nagy, Helfrich, Ragone...
NFL contracts aren't as black and white as you tend to make them. If the Bears want to keep Amos they can, regardless of a contract they gave a QB two years ago.
I'm not sure how I'm making them black and white? And maybe they can keep Amos but can they keep Amos AND Callahan AND Massie? And then can they keep Trevathan, Floyd and Whitehair the year after, then in 2021 Allen Robinson, Prince Amukamara, Mitchell Trubisky, Adam Shaheen, Eddie Jackson, Tarik Cohen...
Yes some difficult choices will always have to be made but why make them harder? What's the marginal improvement in our win % by having Daniel over a cheaper QB. How important is that improvement in the given year and what's the opportunity cost of the improvement in future years? Are future years likely to be more important than the current one?
Those aren't easy questions and there aren't correct answers per se, but I do have reservations, based on Pace's actions (and the general, predictable/understandable short termism in the NFL) that he focusses a little too much on the here and now at the expense of our prime window years or, and this would be more important, developing a structure where we can be perennial contenders rather than cyclical ones.
To be very clear, where we are now is much, much better than what we've been recently but this being an internet message board, I want to strive towards perfection.
Pagan wrote:malk wrote:G08 wrote:I think Daniel's greatest impact on this team is "tutoring" Trubisky. Let's not make this more than what it is.
That's fine until Amos is wearing another jersey because Trubisky got another $7m of coaching in addition to Nagy, Helfrich, Ragone...
Yes it is fine & will continue to be fine.
Properly training of a franchise QB is easily worth 3 Amos.
Amoses.
3 Amoses:s...
Yeah... either way... We've ALL been pissin & moaning about this franchises inability to find & CULTIVATE a franchise QB.
I say... let them do their job of that & maybe even appreciate it.!?
That's a false dichotomy though, this isn't between Amos (or whichever player) or the proper training of a franchise QB but between the marginal improvement of having Daniel instead of another, cheaper vet QB (e.g. the same argument was made for Sanchez) on top of Nagy, Helfrich, Ragone.
Of course there's also the marginal improvement to W/L % of Daniel over a cheaper vet which is important.
My view is that the improvement to an early career QB that comes from a particular vet backup is pretty small. The vast majority comes from actual coaching. Sure, don't put them in a bad situation with an arsehole that's willing them to fail to get their chance but that's not a possibility here.
Pagan wrote:Bearfanuk wrote:Yea give me a chase Daniel who can at least give you a chance to win over a jimmy clausen who gives you zero hope of winning. That Seattle game where it was like a fan had won a raffle prize to play bears QB for the day was both embarrassing and disgusting.
That’s the difference right there. It’s night and day.
Daniels came in & the team went 1 & 1, which is pretty much what you expect in a halfway decent back up scenario.
His biggest value has always been his ability to accelerate Mitchs understanding of the Nagy offense, which seems to have been quite the boon.
TOTALLY worth the $.
This is a good example to highlight part of my point. How important is that extra win, or rather the increase in probability of getting that win over a cheaper backup, in a season where we're not really contending? If that's the win that gets us into the playoffs then I might take a different view but a) I suspect it won't be and b) with our defence and offensive weapons I think there are a good few backups who could have beaten the Lions and/or not thrown 2 interceptions (including a pick 6) and fumbled 4 times against the Giants.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think Pace or the Bear's set up is/are bad by any stretch, but there are things that could be improved.
Mikefive wrote:Was that meant to be a dig or was it just an excellent misspelling?
Never a dig, I think Bobbie Massive is underrated!
