BFO All-Time Bears Draft // Discussion

For all things Chicago Bears

Moderator: wab

User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
wab wrote:I’m looking at it as, how would this player fit in today’s NFL. So even though Stan Jones is a hall of fame player for his era, I don’t know how well a 6’1 250lb offensive lineman would fare. There are exceptions, but that’s the general approach I’m trying to take.
I thought this was already discussed. The talent level or ability of a player is compared directly to the era in which they played. Although Stan Jones was only 6'1" and 250lbs, you would still take him over a T.J. Clemmings at 6'5" 310, because Jones was so much more impactful against the teams he played, during his time in the NFL.

viewtopic.php?p=221516#p221516" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
UOK wrote:
G08 wrote:Just for my mental approach to this... are we trying to field a team that we think could compete in today's NFL? For example, if we were doing that I'd be looking at Brian Urlacher a lot harder than I would Dick Butkus.

Or, are we drafting that player for what he did and who he was in THAT era (meaning their impact on the game will translate and transcend through the years and into our current team construction)?

I like the idea of the latter but I'm open to whatever -- just want everyone on the same page :)
It's really whatever you want it to be. I'd say for your own mental sanity, look at it like we're drafting a league to play football circa 1999-2003. Right around tuck-rule era but before things got out of control.
Image
User avatar
wab
Mod
Posts: 29805
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:49 pm
Has thanked: 127 times
Been thanked: 1956 times

There’s no right or wrong way to draft. I’m just sharing my personal philosophy. I’m not drafting TJ Clemmings in any era.
User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

UOK wrote:
wab wrote:I’m looking at it as, how would this player fit in today’s NFL. So even though Stan Jones is a hall of fame player for his era, I don’t know how well a 6’1 250lb offensive lineman would fare. There are exceptions, but that’s the general approach I’m trying to take.
Right. I kind of was conflicted over taking Nagurski for that reason, but Nagurski is still a pretty big athlete by modern standards, and was clearly a one of a kind talent on the gridiron. I thought that I could take him and use him as an ultraback type figure, and it could be pretty glorious, but that's why I can't wait for the post-draft debate.
For me the guy that really sticks out by changing eras is Hester.

If 2018 rules were used, an argument could be made that he goes undrafted or as a very late round WR at best.
Image
User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

wab wrote:There’s no right or wrong way to draft. I’m just sharing my personal philosophy. I’m not drafting TJ Clemmings in any era.
Somebody here needs to buy a TJ Clemmings jersey if he ever amounts to anything with us.
Image
User avatar
Bears Whiskey Nut
Hall of Famer
Posts: 11017
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 4:06 am
Location: Oak Park, IL
Has thanked: 77 times
Been thanked: 516 times

wab wrote:There’s no right or wrong way to draft. I’m just sharing my personal philosophy. I’m not drafting TJ Clemmings in any era.
But you'd take him over Leno Jr. because Clemmings is taller...right? :taunt:
Image
User avatar
wab
Mod
Posts: 29805
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:49 pm
Has thanked: 127 times
Been thanked: 1956 times

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
wab wrote:There’s no right or wrong way to draft. I’m just sharing my personal philosophy. I’m not drafting TJ Clemmings in any era.
But you'd take him over Leno Jr. because Clemmings is taller...right? :taunt:
It’s possible
User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

I'm convinced the double doink happened because wab hasn't given himself completely to Leno's greatness.

We need you wab. The BEARS need you!
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

G08 wrote:I'm convinced the double doink happened because wab hasn't given himself completely to Leno's greatness.

We need you wab. The BEARS need you!
The overall tone in the chat room needs to improve. That constant negativity is awful. I still remember the tone of that chat room when the Eagles drove down the field and the Bears D held them forever at the goal line. Then I don't remember anybody but a couple of us thinking Biscuit could take us right back downfield.

Don't get me wrong. A lot of us in that chat room I think are fucking hilarious. But when the shit hits the fan we gotta Bear Down.
Image
User avatar
Bears Whiskey Nut
Hall of Famer
Posts: 11017
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 4:06 am
Location: Oak Park, IL
Has thanked: 77 times
Been thanked: 516 times

The Marshall Plan wrote:
G08 wrote:I'm convinced the double doink happened because wab hasn't given himself completely to Leno's greatness.

We need you wab. The BEARS need you!
The overall tone in the chat room needs to improve. That constant negativity is awful. I still remember the tone of that chat room when the Eagles drove down the field and the Bears D held them forever at the goal line. Then I don't remember anybody but a couple of us thinking Biscuit could take us right back downfield.

Don't get me wrong. A lot of us in that chat room I think are fucking hilarious. But when the shit hits the fan we gotta Bear Down.
Hey! I'm taking Nagy's words to heart. "Be YOU!" I'll be a Debbie Downer if I want to.
Image
User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

Apologies if I’m AFK for about an hour. I don’t check the board as instantaneously after work.
Image
User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

AFK... A fat kid?
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
Bears Whiskey Nut
Hall of Famer
Posts: 11017
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 4:06 am
Location: Oak Park, IL
Has thanked: 77 times
Been thanked: 516 times

AFK... After fucking ketchup
Image
User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

Away From Keyboard, you goddamn plebeians.
Image
cblaz11
MVP
Posts: 1272
Joined: Sat Apr 25, 2009 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 111 times

Lol...I’ve spent the past hour looking through the Bears rosters in the 90s.

This draft is exactly what we needed..

Also, I’m building an offensive juggernaut!
User avatar
Bears Whiskey Nut
Hall of Famer
Posts: 11017
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 4:06 am
Location: Oak Park, IL
Has thanked: 77 times
Been thanked: 516 times

cblaz11 wrote:Lol...I’ve spent the past hour looking through the Bears rosters in the 90s.

This draft is exactly what we needed..

Also, I’m building an offensive juggernaut!
Image

Your first 5 out of 6 picks were defensive players...
Image
cblaz11
MVP
Posts: 1272
Joined: Sat Apr 25, 2009 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 111 times

Haha...Patience!

Just sticking to my board lol

Nice pick with Fuller...there have been some good CBs over the years, I was wondering where Fuller would go!

UOK, please change Mack to a defensive lineman on your spread sheet. Lol
User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

cblaz11 wrote:Haha...Patience!

Just sticking to my board lol

Nice pick with Fuller...there have been some good CBs over the years, I was wondering where Fuller would go!

UOK, please change Mack to a defensive lineman on your spread sheet. Lol
Done!
Image
User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

UOK wrote:Made a spreadsheet on Google Sheets for you guys to peruse.

I'll be keeping this updated at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I couldn't get this to open on my phone/at work... but it's fine at home. Any suggestions?
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

G08 wrote:
UOK wrote:Made a spreadsheet on Google Sheets for you guys to peruse.

I'll be keeping this updated at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I couldn't get this to open on my phone/at work... but it's fine at home. Any suggestions?
If you're on a mobile device, you'll probably need the Google Docs app. Android should have it natively. If it's not opening at work, harder to say. Lot of jobs can have network restrictions. How are you trying to access it at work?
Image
User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

UOK wrote:
G08 wrote:
UOK wrote:Made a spreadsheet on Google Sheets for you guys to peruse.

I'll be keeping this updated at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I couldn't get this to open on my phone/at work... but it's fine at home. Any suggestions?
If you're on a mobile device, you'll probably need the Google Docs app. Android should have it natively. If it's not opening at work, harder to say. Lot of jobs can have network restrictions. How are you trying to access it at work?
I just tried on my cell at home and it worked... must be the wifi I'm connecting to there that is blocking it. Bastards.
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
Mikefive
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5189
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 9:33 pm
Location: Valparaiso, IN, USA
Has thanked: 340 times
Been thanked: 278 times

I think the Orlando Pace pick by UOK brings up an interesting question. Do you get the player in his prime when he played for another team? Or the player who played for the Bears in the twilight of his career? I imagine UOK is thinking the former? No right or wrong answers, obviously. It's just how you feel about it.

I was considering another player in a similar situation... I think he played for the Bears for 1 year and then went off and was a Pro Bowler for another team later on. That kind of question will come up more and more in the later rounds. :-p
Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.
User avatar
UOK
Site Admin
Posts: 25147
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:07 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Has thanked: 108 times
Been thanked: 926 times

Mikefive wrote:I think the Orlando Pace pick by UOK brings up an interesting question. Do you get the player in his prime when he played for another team? Or the player who played for the Bears in the twilight of his career? I imagine UOK is thinking the former? No right or wrong answers, obviously. It's just how you feel about it.

I was considering another player in a similar situation... I think he played for the Bears for 1 year and then went off and was a Pro Bowler for another team later on. That kind of question will come up more and more in the later rounds. :-p
You're drafting these players for when they're at their career peaks, day 1. You're drafting the whole career, not simply the Bears era.
Image
User avatar
Mikefive
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5189
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 9:33 pm
Location: Valparaiso, IN, USA
Has thanked: 340 times
Been thanked: 278 times

Otis... You officially suck! Great pick in Todd Bell!
Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.
User avatar
Otis Day
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8061
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:43 pm
Location: Armpit of IL.
Has thanked: 120 times
Been thanked: 306 times

Hell yea!! Kind of surprised he was there.

All along I have been picking my guys based on what they did as a whole and thinking more of them at their peak. For the old guys, 1960s and prior, I am looking at them not compared to today's players but how they dominated in their era. Everyone knows the HOFers from the early years would not even get on the field with players from the 90s to today. But you cannot discount what they did and they fact they kicked ass back in the day.
User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

UOK wrote:
Mikefive wrote:I think the Orlando Pace pick by UOK brings up an interesting question. Do you get the player in his prime when he played for another team? Or the player who played for the Bears in the twilight of his career? I imagine UOK is thinking the former? No right or wrong answers, obviously. It's just how you feel about it.

I was considering another player in a similar situation... I think he played for the Bears for 1 year and then went off and was a Pro Bowler for another team later on. That kind of question will come up more and more in the later rounds. :-p
You're drafting these players for when they're at their career peaks, day 1. You're drafting the whole career, not simply the Bears era.
Both the Jared Allen and Orlando Pace picks were extremely smart moves. Those names didn't even enter my brain and they should have.
Image
User avatar
Bears Whiskey Nut
Hall of Famer
Posts: 11017
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 4:06 am
Location: Oak Park, IL
Has thanked: 77 times
Been thanked: 516 times

The Marshall Plan wrote:
UOK wrote:
Mikefive wrote:I think the Orlando Pace pick by UOK brings up an interesting question. Do you get the player in his prime when he played for another team? Or the player who played for the Bears in the twilight of his career? I imagine UOK is thinking the former? No right or wrong answers, obviously. It's just how you feel about it.

I was considering another player in a similar situation... I think he played for the Bears for 1 year and then went off and was a Pro Bowler for another team later on. That kind of question will come up more and more in the later rounds. :-p
You're drafting these players for when they're at their career peaks, day 1. You're drafting the whole career, not simply the Bears era.
Both the Jared Allen and Orlando Pace picks were extremely smart moves. Those names didn't even enter my brain and they should have.
You really have to dig around. Remember that Angelo was the king at bringing in washed up skill players in hopes that they could rekindle past magic. So if you're drafting for talent, you have to know the player's entire career.
Image
User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

Otis Day wrote:Hell yea!! Kind of surprised he was there.

All along I have been picking my guys based on what they did as a whole and thinking more of them at their peak. For the old guys, 1960s and prior, I am looking at them not compared to today's players but how they dominated in their era. Everyone knows the HOFers from the early years would not even get on the field with players from the 90s to today. But you cannot discount what they did and they fact they kicked ass back in the day.
This isn't fair! Otis was born in 19-ought-6!
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
G08
Hall of Famer
Posts: 20560
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Location: Football Hell
Has thanked: 209 times
Been thanked: 758 times

When we're all finished up with this, I'm going to tweet at Dan Pompei and see if he's willing to judge which team he thinks is the best.

Why the hell not, right?
9 PLAYOFF APPEARANCES IN THE PAST 35 SEASONS

User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

G08 wrote:When we're all finished up with this, I'm going to tweet at Dan Pompei and see if he's willing to judge which team he thinks is the best.

Why the hell not, right?
Why not?
Image
User avatar
The Marshall Plan
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8411
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:47 am
Location: Parts Unknown
Has thanked: 909 times
Been thanked: 1277 times

In doing some research for this I found a sad, but interesting, Bears statistic about rushing.

Did you know?....

Jim Harbaugh has more rushing yards (1,609) than either Cedric Benson (1,593) or Curtis Enis (1,497).

Yikes!
Image
Post Reply