Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetime

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Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetime

Sun Jun 02, 2019 3:10 pm

Prompted by the All-Time list.

Not looking for who you think is underrated/overrated specifically based on their list, just by Bears fans or NFL fans in general.

I already gave my top for each one in that thread.

Moriarty wrote: There's only one other guy I'd even mention in a conversation about Most Overrated Bear of All Time and Briggs wins with ease.
Moriarty wrote: McMichael's my easy vote for Most Underrated Bear of All Time.

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* Technically, Sapp is credited with 1.5 more, but McMichael has 2 yrs where sacks weren't an official statistic, so I'm confident he actually wins.
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wab
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time (or your lif

Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:56 am

This is kind of a tough one, especially when it comes to all-time. I generally try to do it by era.

In recent memory I'd say Mike Brown was pretty overrated. I mean I absolutely LOVED the dude, but picking off badly thrown balls and making big hits sort of inflated how fans viewed him. It's also what made him fun. But I think objectively, he wasn't as good as we all make him out to be.

As far as underrated, I think he's currently on the team. Akiem Hicks is one of the most underrated players in all of the NFL right now.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time (or your lif

Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:05 am

While I concur on Brown on big time (just never was consistent enough but has splashes that got people's attention), my overrated would be McMahon. Loved the dude and the team seemed to win when he played, but it wasn't his play that won those games. He profited from a top notch D and Walter Payton.


Underrated I am going with Mark Bortz. Coming out of U of Iowa a DL. Converts to OL and starts all 16 games his rookie year. He would be one of the anchors on that line for 12 years.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:29 am

Going from my lifetime, since I can only really judge what I've observed.

Overrated: Marty Booker. He had great hands and made a lot of snags, but he was not at all a game-changing receiver.

Underrated: I think Charles Leno Jr will go down as one of the most underrated players in Bears history. He's by no means a bad LT, but infinitely better than what he's given credit for. He's held one of the most difficult positions in sports down for years now, and while it's not at a Pro-Bowl level of dominance or consistency, he's by no means a swinging gate.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:19 pm

YAAS SOME LENO LOVE

I have to agree with Mori on Briggs. Nod to wab as McMahon gets my first runner-up.

As for underrated, can't disagree with Hicks or Leno, but I'm gonna cast my vote for Corey Graham, who was even underappreciated by his own damned team.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:53 pm

I've heard way too many opposing players talk about how devastating Briggs was to face. I can't call him overrated.

Hicks is getting love now. Leno is one of the top 5-6 left tackles in football and nobody talks about him.

Mike Brown is a great choice for overrated.

Alex Brown was always a little better than credited, IMO

Can I put Ditka down (strictly as a coach) for the most overrated Bear ever? He's a hall of fame TE, but the love he gets as a coach is a joke. He shouldn't be praised like a god for winning one SB with that team. He should be blasphemed for not winning more than that.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:08 pm

Briggs for me as well. Everything was funnelled to him and Urlacher still, easily, outshone him. He was obviously good but not great.

Underrated? I love me some Peanut. Still annoyed we didn't bring him back in 2015 ($2m for Tillman or $3m for Alan God Damn Ball)... But underrated, absolutely. Fumbles might not be quite as good as interceptions but they're still great. Throw in a lot of passes defended and it makes up for the lack of eye popping interception numbers. Plus this was against some great wideouts in the NFC North.

He gets a lot of respect but not enough.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:05 am

One of my top 5 favorite Bears all time is James Big Cat Williams. The guy played through every injury and held Reggie White in check whenever we played the Packers (think White logged 2.5 sacks against us vs. Williams). The dude rarely gets mentioned except for his games played streak or when someone points out that he had some troubles with speed rushers.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Tue Jun 04, 2019 1:36 pm

Overrated -- Olin Kreutz. Always seemed to get pushed around by top level talent, and benefited from guard play.

Underrated -- Curtis Conway. probably a little biased here, but he was my favorite growing up.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:05 pm

Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.

Underrated - Charles Tillman. The guy never really got the credit he deserved. I loved watching him line up against megatron.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:21 pm

Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.

Underrated - Charles Tillman. The guy never really got the credit he deserved. I loved watching him line up against megatron.
I think Tillman was always pretty well respected across the NFL, and now especially that he's retired.

And I guess maybe you could consider Long a little overrated now that he's had health issues, but he was absolutely worthy of the hype prior to that.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:21 pm

Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.
I agree 100% on Long... I like the guy as well but if his Dad wasn't Howey I just don't think he would've been in the pro bowl or mentioned as he is as one of the best. Runner up is Forte... I know I know... but after watching Payton and hearing all the younger kids going nuts over Forte they just never saw Payton play. Forte was good but one of the NFL best no way...

I like Hicks for underrated but I also think Suey, Gentry or Waddle needs a mention here... They were great football players that never seemed to get any respect or acknowledgment. At least not from the league... Bear fans know how great they were.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:37 pm

wab wrote:
Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.

Underrated - Charles Tillman. The guy never really got the credit he deserved. I loved watching him line up against megatron.
I think Tillman was always pretty well respected across the NFL, and now especially that he's retired.

And I guess maybe you could consider Long a little overrated now that he's had health issues, but he was absolutely worthy of the hype prior to that.

I feel most would never put Tillman in the same category as a Revis, Peterson or Sherman for that matter, even though he very well should be. IMO, that makes him underrated, he basically revolutionized an aspect of the game.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:41 pm

Knuckles wrote:
Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.
I agree 100% on Long... I like the guy as well but if his Dad wasn't Howey I just don't think he would've been in the pro bowl or mentioned as he is as one of the best. Runner up is Forte... I know I know... but after watching Payton and hearing all the younger kids going nuts over Forte they just never saw Payton play. Forte was good but one of the NFL best no way...

I like Hicks for underrated but I also think Suey, Gentry or Waddle needs a mention here... They were great football players that never seemed to get any respect or acknowledgment. At least not from the league... Bear fans know how great they were.

Waddle was on my short list but I feel he didn’t put up enough stats even though he made some spectacular catches.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:46 pm

Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:48 pm

AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:34 pm

Richie wrote:I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman
No you don't. ;)
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:38 pm

During my time watching the Bears (off the top of my head):

Overrated: Kyle Long, Lance Briggs, most any LB playing OLB to Urlacher's MLB, and Mike Brown.

Underrated: Trace Armstrong, Biscuit, Jordan Howard (Namely over the past six months to a year. His trade was one of those personnel moves I HATED to see happen but I understand why it did. I hope Howard makes it into the HOF.), Adewale Ogunleye, Alex Brown, Jay Cutler, and Anthony Thomas.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:13 pm

The Marshall Plan wrote:During my time watching the Bears (off the top of my head):

Overrated: Kyle Long, Lance Briggs, most any LB playing OLB to Urlacher's MLB, and Mike Brown.

Underrated: Trace Armstrong, Biscuit, Jordan Howard (Namely over the past six months to a year. His trade was one of those personnel moves I HATED to see happen but I understand why it did. I hope Howard makes it into the HOF.), Adewale Ogunleye, Alex Brown, Jay Cutler, and Anthony Thomas.
I loved the A-Train that rookie season, but dude was pretty poor after that. No burst/acceleration in the open field, poor vision... The 01 O-line was actually very good and did wonders for him. I think the remainder of his career is more telling of the kind of back he was.

I agree with the others. I think Briggs is getting an unnecessary amount of hate, though. I understand he's not as good as the near HOF numbers he posted. However, he was one f'ing hell of a compliment to Urlacher. I also don't think that Lance Briggs is very "remembered" outside of Chicago and probably other fans within the division. I don't think people "rate" him much, at all.

When you hear opposing players talk about the Lovie Bears defense's. Yes, Urlacher's name goes first... but they ALWAYS mention how they hated Briggs as well.

Heath Evans actually mentions him before Urlacher when questioned at 0:20 of this interview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1IlxZmd3v0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:02 am

Over rated : Alonzo "pajamas in the snow" Spellman DE - knucklehead got a huge contract to remain a Bear based on .... something, when they would have been better off letting him go sign with Jacksonville ... don't know who said it originally, but "looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane" defined his entire career

Under rated : Jim Osborne DT - wasn't the biggest nor fastest nor strongest ... but he was the best Bears defensive lineman for a long time and a sold anchor on the Bears of the 70's ... the fact the Bears of that era didn't win much wasn't the fault of the defense
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:29 am

Richie wrote:
AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
In my view, Tillman was NEVER EVER a shutdown corner. He was a very good CB, particularly at the end of his career. It was Tillman's outrageous propensity to knock the ball loose that made him great.

I'd assert that Donnell Woolford in that one year when he was really, really good, was clearly a better coverage guy than Tillman ever was. In that one year, he was the only CB I ever saw in a Bears uni who deserved the term "shutdown corner". So I'll say that Donnell Woolford is underrated, IMO.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:10 pm

Mikefive wrote:
Richie wrote:
AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
In my view, Tillman was NEVER EVER a shutdown corner. He was a very good CB, particularly at the end of his career. It was Tillman's outrageous propensity to knock the ball loose that made him great.

I'd assert that Donnell Woolford in that one year when he was really, really good, was clearly a better coverage guy than Tillman ever was. In that one year, he was the only CB I ever saw in a Bears uni who deserved the term "shutdown corner". So I'll say that Donnell Woolford is underrated, IMO.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WoolDo00.htm

1992 looks like Woolford’s best year. He had 7 picks and 94 tackles that year. Tillman never had more than 5 INTs in a season. However it was the fumbles (no surprise) that puts Tillman over the top. He had 44 forced fumbles over his career (10 in one season! 2012) v Woolford’s 3. I also remember that Woolford had a fantastic year and it was on a bad 1992 Bears team on top of it. In my opinion though, Tillman was better.
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