Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetime

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wab
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:21 pm

Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.

Underrated - Charles Tillman. The guy never really got the credit he deserved. I loved watching him line up against megatron.
I think Tillman was always pretty well respected across the NFL, and now especially that he's retired.

And I guess maybe you could consider Long a little overrated now that he's had health issues, but he was absolutely worthy of the hype prior to that.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:21 pm

Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.
I agree 100% on Long... I like the guy as well but if his Dad wasn't Howey I just don't think he would've been in the pro bowl or mentioned as he is as one of the best. Runner up is Forte... I know I know... but after watching Payton and hearing all the younger kids going nuts over Forte they just never saw Payton play. Forte was good but one of the NFL best no way...

I like Hicks for underrated but I also think Suey, Gentry or Waddle needs a mention here... They were great football players that never seemed to get any respect or acknowledgment. At least not from the league... Bear fans know how great they were.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:37 pm

wab wrote:
Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.

Underrated - Charles Tillman. The guy never really got the credit he deserved. I loved watching him line up against megatron.
I think Tillman was always pretty well respected across the NFL, and now especially that he's retired.

And I guess maybe you could consider Long a little overrated now that he's had health issues, but he was absolutely worthy of the hype prior to that.

I feel most would never put Tillman in the same category as a Revis, Peterson or Sherman for that matter, even though he very well should be. IMO, that makes him underrated, he basically revolutionized an aspect of the game.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:41 pm

Knuckles wrote:
Funkster wrote:Overrated - Kyle Long. Love the dude but IMO, doesn’t really live up to the hype.
I agree 100% on Long... I like the guy as well but if his Dad wasn't Howey I just don't think he would've been in the pro bowl or mentioned as he is as one of the best. Runner up is Forte... I know I know... but after watching Payton and hearing all the younger kids going nuts over Forte they just never saw Payton play. Forte was good but one of the NFL best no way...

I like Hicks for underrated but I also think Suey, Gentry or Waddle needs a mention here... They were great football players that never seemed to get any respect or acknowledgment. At least not from the league... Bear fans know how great they were.

Waddle was on my short list but I feel he didn’t put up enough stats even though he made some spectacular catches.
“Protect this fucking house, go all out, leave that shit out on the field, let’s have some fun, makes some plays baby ” Mitch Trubisky #believethesleeve
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:46 pm

Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:48 pm

AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:34 pm

Richie wrote:I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman
No you don't. ;)
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:38 pm

During my time watching the Bears (off the top of my head):

Overrated: Kyle Long, Lance Briggs, most any LB playing OLB to Urlacher's MLB, and Mike Brown.

Underrated: Trace Armstrong, Biscuit, Jordan Howard (Namely over the past six months to a year. His trade was one of those personnel moves I HATED to see happen but I understand why it did. I hope Howard makes it into the HOF.), Adewale Ogunleye, Alex Brown, Jay Cutler, and Anthony Thomas.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:13 pm

The Marshall Plan wrote:During my time watching the Bears (off the top of my head):

Overrated: Kyle Long, Lance Briggs, most any LB playing OLB to Urlacher's MLB, and Mike Brown.

Underrated: Trace Armstrong, Biscuit, Jordan Howard (Namely over the past six months to a year. His trade was one of those personnel moves I HATED to see happen but I understand why it did. I hope Howard makes it into the HOF.), Adewale Ogunleye, Alex Brown, Jay Cutler, and Anthony Thomas.
I loved the A-Train that rookie season, but dude was pretty poor after that. No burst/acceleration in the open field, poor vision... The 01 O-line was actually very good and did wonders for him. I think the remainder of his career is more telling of the kind of back he was.

I agree with the others. I think Briggs is getting an unnecessary amount of hate, though. I understand he's not as good as the near HOF numbers he posted. However, he was one f'ing hell of a compliment to Urlacher. I also don't think that Lance Briggs is very "remembered" outside of Chicago and probably other fans within the division. I don't think people "rate" him much, at all.

When you hear opposing players talk about the Lovie Bears defense's. Yes, Urlacher's name goes first... but they ALWAYS mention how they hated Briggs as well.

Heath Evans actually mentions him before Urlacher when questioned at 0:20 of this interview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1IlxZmd3v0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:02 am

Over rated : Alonzo "pajamas in the snow" Spellman DE - knucklehead got a huge contract to remain a Bear based on .... something, when they would have been better off letting him go sign with Jacksonville ... don't know who said it originally, but "looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane" defined his entire career

Under rated : Jim Osborne DT - wasn't the biggest nor fastest nor strongest ... but he was the best Bears defensive lineman for a long time and a sold anchor on the Bears of the 70's ... the fact the Bears of that era didn't win much wasn't the fault of the defense
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:29 am

Richie wrote:
AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
In my view, Tillman was NEVER EVER a shutdown corner. He was a very good CB, particularly at the end of his career. It was Tillman's outrageous propensity to knock the ball loose that made him great.

I'd assert that Donnell Woolford in that one year when he was really, really good, was clearly a better coverage guy than Tillman ever was. In that one year, he was the only CB I ever saw in a Bears uni who deserved the term "shutdown corner". So I'll say that Donnell Woolford is underrated, IMO.
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Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Bears of All-Time/Your Lifetim

Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:10 pm

Mikefive wrote:
Richie wrote:
AZ_Bearfan wrote:Tillman was a beast. Name one guy that could contain Megatron and shut down Moss twice a year.
I hate to correct a praise of Peanut Tillman, because he may be my favorite Bear of all-time.

However, his career only overlapped with Moss in Minnesota for two seasons in 2003 and 2004. He only started two of those four possible games. 03 was his rookie year and the first game vs Minnesota was very early in the season (week 2). He was not getting much playing time at that point. Later in the year was the "taking it away from Moss" play - where he undoubtedly stepped up. In 2004 he was injured and only saw Minnesota once in the Chad Hutchinson game. Which the Bears won. Moss also caught 9 of 11 targets for 93 yards and a TD.

So, he only faced Moss twice and one time Moss had a really good day. "Shutting down Moss twice a year" not only makes it sound like the two engaged in two epic battles per season... but that Tillman typically emerged on top. As much as I would love to agree, it's just not the case on either front. He saw Moss twice, he made a memorable play against him and the total results were mixed.
In my view, Tillman was NEVER EVER a shutdown corner. He was a very good CB, particularly at the end of his career. It was Tillman's outrageous propensity to knock the ball loose that made him great.

I'd assert that Donnell Woolford in that one year when he was really, really good, was clearly a better coverage guy than Tillman ever was. In that one year, he was the only CB I ever saw in a Bears uni who deserved the term "shutdown corner". So I'll say that Donnell Woolford is underrated, IMO.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WoolDo00.htm

1992 looks like Woolford’s best year. He had 7 picks and 94 tackles that year. Tillman never had more than 5 INTs in a season. However it was the fumbles (no surprise) that puts Tillman over the top. He had 44 forced fumbles over his career (10 in one season! 2012) v Woolford’s 3. I also remember that Woolford had a fantastic year and it was on a bad 1992 Bears team on top of it. In my opinion though, Tillman was better.
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