Bears fire OC Helfrich, coaches Hiestand (OL), Gilbride (TE), Olivo (ST Asst.)

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Zack Pearson
Matt Nagy says the biggest step he wants Mitchell Trubisky to take this offseason is to master understanding coverages from defenses.
And yet Ragone's not on the list of those offensive coaches getting fired?

He's been the only ever-present since Mitch was drafted and the HC and play caller says he still doesn't understand coverages? If that isn't an indictment of your QB coach then what is? The less than stellar 85.8 career passer rating? What about the pitiful 6.1 ypa this year?

I'm honestly amazed that Ragone wasn't the first to go.
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This is a good start. The offense is a big problem holding back this teams success. The run game was a mess, the O-line was a mess and the TE’s were a mess!
“Protect this fucking house, go all out, leave that shit out on the field, let’s have some fun, makes some plays baby ” Mitch Trubisky #believethesleeve
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HisRoyalSweetness wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 5:23 pm
Zack Pearson
Matt Nagy says the biggest step he wants Mitchell Trubisky to take this offseason is to master understanding coverages from defenses.
And yet Ragone's not on the list of those offensive coaches getting fired?

He's been the only ever-present since Mitch was drafted and the HC and play caller says he still doesn't understand coverages? If that isn't an indictment of your QB coach then what is? The less than stellar 85.8 career passer rating? What about the pitiful 6.1 ypa this year?

I'm honestly amazed that Ragone wasn't the first to go.
I was stunned to see him stick around. I think Mitch clearly has vouched for this guy, repeatedly, so he's safe.

Not sure how I feel about that.

As for Helfrich and Hiestand, I'm glad they're gone. I'm sure there is a level of scapegoating that is going on, but the line was garbage and the run game worse so logically it makes sense.

I'm extremely curious to see who they bring in as replacements.
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With a decent to good running game..o line blocking..maybe we see Trubisky improve to what we need him to be.
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I also don’t understand how Ragone survived given Trubisky’s abysmal play but I think maybe they’re just holding onto him until the new OC is hired. Whoever that turns out to be might want their own guy.
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Wtf Furrey still has a job??? Also how you gonna blame the TE coach what’s he supposed to do with fucking UDFAs and Ben Braunaker?
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Agree with @Rakshir and @@BR0D1E86. As infuriating as some of Nagy's decisions were, he technically hasn't had a losing season yet. Let's compare that to the stats of previous coaches in their first two seasons:

Wannstedt - 4-12 & 4-12
Jauron - 6-10 & 5-11
Smith - 5-11 & 11-5
Trestman - 8-8 & 5-11
Fox - 6-10 & 3-13

So this is the first coach in over 20 years that's done a halfway decent job. Granted, the bar is not high but he deserves another season at least before any decisions are made.
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Xee wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:19 pm Agree with @Rakshir and @@BR0D1E86. As infuriating as some of Nagy's decisions were, he technically hasn't had a losing season yet. Let's compare that to the stats of previous coaches in their first two seasons:

Wannstedt - 4-12 & 4-12
Jauron - 6-10 & 5-11
Smith - 5-11 & 11-5
Trestman - 8-8 & 5-11
Fox - 6-10 & 3-13

So this is the first coach in over 20 years that's done a halfway decent job. Granted, the bar is not high but he deserves another season at least before any decisions are made.
Matt Nagy surpassed George "Papa Bear" Halas with the most wins as a Chicago Bears head coach in his first two seasons.
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Hopefully they go after Shurmur and I'd like an explanation on how Ragone stayed. Mitch has clearly regressed and he's been here all 3 years
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Maybe they're waiting for new OC to chime in on the QB coach situation ?
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https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive- ... lar-season
Ranking all 32 NFL offensive lines following the 2019 regular season


25. Chicago Bears

The Bears took an expected step backward this season, spearheaded by regression in volatile areas from Mitchell Trubisky. Part of that decline, though, was worse play from the offensive line. When the Bears allowed pressure this season, they allowed it fast. Their average time to pressure allowed of 2.37 seconds was 29th in the league, ahead of only the Dolphins, Chargers and Falcons. A silver lining for the group came from James Daniels after he switched over to left guard. Daniels’ 73.9 overall grade at left guard ranked fifth among all qualifiers at the position.
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RustyTrubisky wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:53 pm https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive- ... lar-season
Ranking all 32 NFL offensive lines following the 2019 regular season


25. Chicago Bears

The Bears took an expected step backward this season, spearheaded by regression in volatile areas from Mitchell Trubisky. Part of that decline, though, was worse play from the offensive line. When the Bears allowed pressure this season, they allowed it fast. Their average time to pressure allowed of 2.37 seconds was 29th in the league, ahead of only the Dolphins, Chargers and Falcons. A silver lining for the group came from James Daniels after he switched over to left guard. Daniels’ 73.9 overall grade at left guard ranked fifth among all qualifiers at the position.
Why did they ever switch Daniels and Whitehair? Why why why why why....

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UOK wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:25 pm
Dardango wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:14 pm The problem is Nagy and Pace. This team will not get better until those two go.
See Browns, Cleveland for why this level of repeated turnover is a horrible, horrible idea.
Disagree Dardango, and UOK has a VERY good point. Pace has brought in a ton of talent, and you have to give him respect for the depth he created particularly on the D. He's made some mistakes, all GMs do. Nagy had some bad games this year, about 3 of them, but when your Oline is incapable of blocking either run or pass, nothing you call is going to work. Nothing. So lets see how the new coaches, once hired, do to get these guys back into form.
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I’ve never seen a more poorly blocking team then the 2019 Chicago Bears...too many times we saw-

1. Lineman standing around while our skill guys fought for more yards
2. Lineman confused on their blocking assignments and blocking the wrong guy
3. Receivers and TEs not finishing blocks down field costing extra yardage
4. Lineman standing upright on the snap vs driving down field on run plays

Say what you want, that’s all 100% coaching. Part of that is Nagy, and part of that is the OC and line coach. I understand that Heinstand is looked at highly...but after this year, I don’t know why.

Leno and Massie have proven they can be solid starting OTs...Whitehair and Daniels have all the tools to be successful..yet all 4 took major steps back.

We need an OC who will step in, pound the fundamentals into these guys daily, offer Nagy another way of looking at certain situations, and add value as a leader.

I feel we can win with 4 lineman returning and better depth...but we HAVE to sign or draft a top OG.
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I'm beating the drum for the Bears to look at LSU's passing game coordinator, Joe Brady, to be considered as QB or OC. Brady was an offensive assistant with the Saints. He was brought in by LSU in 2019 to coach Joe Burrows, who had a record breaking year in an explosive passing (and not bad) running offense. He's only 31 and deserves a look to work with Trubisky.
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I don't know about Helfrich but Hiestand has a good reputation. All I know is the goats weren't the ones that called 10 or fewer runs in an entire game... more than once. I guess we're being asked to give Nagy a pass on that and just assume he knew how bad the run game was going to be ... going into the first game of the season? I guess it's possible that H & H were micromanaging the run game too - and forced Nagy to run 29 up the gut from shotgun. In no way was Nagy responsible for any of this.

I do believe the Oline looked completely unprepared and uncoached. With pretty close to the exact same crew, they went from decent last year to pathetic this year. Same guys; changed scheme ... player's fault of course. And the Oline coach's fault. I bet Hiestand loved coaching the guys to block for Nagy's tactical attack... and boy are we lucky to get to see another Oline coach come in and be successful in Nagy 3.0.
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Grizzled wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:34 am I'm beating the drum for the Bears to look at LSU's passing game coordinator, Joe Brady, to be considered as QB or OC. Brady was an offensive assistant with the Saints. He was brought in by LSU in 2019 to coach Joe Burrows, who had a record breaking year in an explosive passing (and not bad) running offense. He's only 31 and deserves a look to work with Trubisky.
If you're that guy, do you really want to go from being a star for turning around LSU's offense and helping Burrow become a star... to taking direction from Nagy and being forced to coach up 10 in Nagy's system? I'll guess there are more attractive opportunities for him.
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UOK wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 3:33 pm
Moriarty wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 3:25 pm

You can't keep bad GMs and HCs and expect to have any level of success.
You can't have it both ways. Basically are you on team Bengals (stick with everyone for way, way too long) or team Browns (fires everyone constantly)?
I don't understand this at all.

Why do you always need to be at one of two extremes (and therefore ridiculously wrong most of the time)?

Why not evaluate each situation individually and sometimes launch people quickly and sometimes be a little more patient, and hopefully through the power of good judgement, make the right choice the majority of the time?
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 5:09 am
RustyTrubisky wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:53 pm https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive- ... lar-season
Ranking all 32 NFL offensive lines following the 2019 regular season


25. Chicago Bears

The Bears took an expected step backward this season, spearheaded by regression in volatile areas from Mitchell Trubisky. Part of that decline, though, was worse play from the offensive line. When the Bears allowed pressure this season, they allowed it fast. Their average time to pressure allowed of 2.37 seconds was 29th in the league, ahead of only the Dolphins, Chargers and Falcons. A silver lining for the group came from James Daniels after he switched over to left guard. Daniels’ 73.9 overall grade at left guard ranked fifth among all qualifiers at the position.
Why did they ever switch Daniels and Whitehair? Why why why why why....
Because Whitehair is kind of a junky snapper and Daniels is kind of small as a G. Still it seems as though the C responsibilities were too much for Daniels. This is the best fit until further notice. They need to bring in an interior guy. If they brought in one with either G/T or G/C flexibility that would probably be best case.
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G08 wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:39 pm
Xee wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:19 pm Agree with @Rakshir and @@BR0D1E86. As infuriating as some of Nagy's decisions were, he technically hasn't had a losing season yet. Let's compare that to the stats of previous coaches in their first two seasons:

Wannstedt - 4-12 & 4-12
Jauron - 6-10 & 5-11
Smith - 5-11 & 11-5
Trestman - 8-8 & 5-11
Fox - 6-10 & 3-13

So this is the first coach in over 20 years that's done a halfway decent job. Granted, the bar is not high but he deserves another season at least before any decisions are made.
Matt Nagy surpassed George "Papa Bear" Halas with the most wins as a Chicago Bears head coach in his first two seasons.
That's slightly less impressive when you consider the Staleys/Bears only played 8 games in 1920 and 11 in 1921.
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wab wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 4:33 pm These are the guys I expected to be let go. I like how everyone is all "SCAPEGOAT!!" after being told that Helfrich and HH were in charge of the running game - a super shitty running game mind you. Hence the firing.

when the Bears actually used a running game, it appeared they could actually be good at it ... and this is with a patchwork offensive line ... Montgomery could have reasonably been a 1000+ yard rusher

but Nagy refused to stay committed to it

and I don't consider Cohen up the middle to be an especially successful commitment to running the ball ... Nagy did ... and when it failed, he simply went pass happy


wab wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 4:33 pmSome of you dudes are different.
eh ... we're all different ... different ideas, different perspectives

only thing we share is the disappointment
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Boris13c wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 2:30 pm
wab wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 4:33 pm These are the guys I expected to be let go. I like how everyone is all "SCAPEGOAT!!" after being told that Helfrich and HH were in charge of the running game - a super shitty running game mind you. Hence the firing.

when the Bears actually used a running game, it appeared they could actually be good at it ... and this is with a patchwork offensive line ... Montgomery could have reasonably been a 1000+ yard rusher

but Nagy refused to stay committed to it

and I don't consider Cohen up the middle to be an especially successful commitment to running the ball ... Nagy did ... and when it failed, he simply went pass happy
I don’t think it’s quite as simple as being a matter of quitting on the run because a run failed. I think it has more to do with offensive lineman missing simple assignments like double teaming a guy.
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IE wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:42 am
Grizzled wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:34 am I'm beating the drum for the Bears to look at LSU's passing game coordinator, Joe Brady, to be considered as QB or OC. Brady was an offensive assistant with the Saints. He was brought in by LSU in 2019 to coach Joe Burrows, who had a record breaking year in an explosive passing (and not bad) running offense. He's only 31 and deserves a look to work with Trubisky.
If you're that guy, do you really want to go from being a star for turning around LSU's offense and helping Burrow become a star... to taking direction from Nagy and being forced to coach up 10 in Nagy's system? I'll guess there are more attractive opportunities for him.
Good points but he’s got to start somewhere if he even wants to coach in the pros. He may want to stay in college. I doubt the Bears reach out.
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Dardango wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:14 pm The problem is Nagy and Pace. This team will not get better until those two go.
Pace, Nagy and Trubisky.
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Juan Castillo hired as new OLine coach. Worked with Nagy in Philly.
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The Cooler King wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:03 pm Juan Castillo hired as new OLine coach. Worked with Nagy in Philly.
Hmm, is this guy considered an upgrade to Heistand? Looks like he didn't work in 2019 after being let go from the Bills after the 2018 season. Reading about him on the Bills subreddit, the knocks they have against him are the same things that were said about Heistand. Basically he didn't have a lot to work with and wasn't able to accomplish much in his 2 years with the Bills. He has past experience with Nagy though so hopefully that helps.
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Xee wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:51 pm
The Cooler King wrote: Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:03 pm Juan Castillo hired as new OLine coach. Worked with Nagy in Philly.
Hmm, is this guy considered an upgrade to Heistand? Looks like he didn't work in 2019 after being let go from the Bills after the 2018 season. Reading about him on the Bills subreddit, the knocks they have against him are the same things that were said about Heistand. Basically he didn't have a lot to work with and wasn't able to accomplish much in his 2 years with the Bills. He has past experience with Nagy though so hopefully that helps.
He has an interesting background. Actually spend 2 seasons as D coordinator under Reid as well. Brings lots of experience.

There were two really good O line coaches from fired staffs with Callahan in WAS and Matsko in CAR. I think Castillo might be the only zone guy of those though, which I'm sure played a role. Additionally since he was out of work, I have to think Nagy had this one lined up, which I'm sure helped expedite the decision to part ways with Heistand. Gives me hope the reason he hasn't moved on from Ragone is he's still searching for his replacement, and could be he's hoping to get someone currently on a playoff team.
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Xee wrote: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:19 pm Agree with @Rakshir and @@BR0D1E86. As infuriating as some of Nagy's decisions were, he technically hasn't had a losing season yet. Let's compare that to the stats of previous coaches in their first two seasons:

Wannstedt - 4-12 & 4-12
Jauron - 6-10 & 5-11
Smith - 5-11 & 11-5
Trestman - 8-8 & 5-11
Fox - 6-10 & 3-13

So this is the first coach in over 20 years that's done a halfway decent job. Granted, the bar is not high but he deserves another season at least before any decisions are made.
Records are really deceptive when taken out of context of what phase the team was in at the time.
(Also, those are Wanny's last 2 years, not his first 2)

Wanny year 1, they tried to win with old Ditka guys and nearly succeeded. Year 2 they started the turnover in earnest - and went to the playoffs and won a game in the first year of rebuilding.

Jauron's last season was a rebuild - partly forced on him by Angelo, partly his own choice. So when Lovie arrived, they were already 1 year into it. He won 11 games in his 2nd yr, which was the 3rd year of rebuilding.

Poor Trestman never even got a chance to rebuild. He inherited an ancient team with a delusional mandate to keep winning with it.

Fox rebuilt for 3 years, never winning.

Nagy stepped into a rebuild 3 years underway and won in his first year, but the 4th year of rebuilding.

(Jauron's tenure is murkier and harder to define, at least from what I recall without researching, so I'm leaving it out.)

So, in that context, the HCs first broke out in (rebuild yr, their yr)

Wanny 1/2
Lovie 3/2
Trestman -/- (no rebuild, no breakout)
Fox 3+/3+ (didn't happen within 3)
Nagy 4/1


So, with that context, Nagy's breakthrough was pretty long into a team rebuild. There's no way to prove whether he could or couldn't have achieved it sooner, if he'd have gotten the job 1-2 yrs earlier (although I'm skeptical). But I see scant debate to be had that he stepped into the best situation of anyone being compared here.
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2019 teams reverse-engineered Nagy
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Thanks @Moriarty for the info. I completely admit that context matters and that just looking at a Win/Loss record leaves a lot of information out. Still, if we take that further, isn't that basically saying that a coach can only be as a good as the team he leads? Meaning, if he comes in when a team is in a rebuilding stage, he won't be able to really affect the outcome of games until the rebuild is finished? And if that's the case, does it even matter who the head coach is?

My counter-question would be, what about all teams who have tons of talent on paper but are unable to string together winning seasons? If the coach isn't a factor in those teams, than what explanation there is there for them not to being able to succeed? Doesn't the HC deserve some of the blame in those situations and thus, shouldn't a HC deserve some of the credit when a team does succeed?
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