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Mike Groh was fired from PHI. Formerly was a Bears WR coach before being passing game Co in LA (under Fisher) and then WR and OC in PHI. So he brings the Reid tree familiarity without being a Reid disciple.

Could make sense given familiarity.

Also goes without saying that PHI is now probably Shurmur competition for the Bears.

No OC worth his salt is coming unless Nagy lets him do more than hold a clipboard. Yes, the guy will help "design plays" but an OC wants to call them also. Pace needs to put the hammer down on this with Nagy.

Grizzled wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:10 am No OC worth his salt is coming unless Nagy lets him do more than hold a clipboard. Yes, the guy will help "design plays" but an OC wants to call them also. Pace needs to put the hammer down on this with Nagy.

This is true.

Which is why, IF Shurmur gets hired, that you can bet Nagy is giving up (or has had taken away) playcalling.

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:29 am

Grizzled wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:10 am No OC worth his salt is coming unless Nagy lets him do more than hold a clipboard. Yes, the guy will help "design plays" but an OC wants to call them also. Pace needs to put the hammer down on this with Nagy.

This is true.

Which is why, IF Shurmur gets hired, that you can bet Nagy is giving up (or has had taken away) playcalling.

I kinda disagree. Andy Reid chucks out coaching candidates every year and he calls the plays most of the time.

Granted, Nagy doesn't have a resume that touches Reid, but as the old adage goes - there's only so many of these openings each year.

I wonder if it won’t be Childress, not that I like that.

Bieniemy's not calling plays. Groh didn't call play. It's kind of split around the league. Wab is right, tho, there's only 32 OC jobs in the world, few guys will turn down the opportunity to take one.

Grizzled wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:26 pm Bieniemy's not calling plays. Groh didn't call play. It's kind of split around the league. Wab is right, tho, there's only 32 OC jobs in the world, few guys will turn down the opportunity to take one.

Unfortunately, the few who would turn down that opportunity happen to be the best ones (hence, why they have the luxury to turn it down). So I'm not sure this makes me feel any better about it. We don't just need any OC, we need a good one.

Helfrich was ok with it, but he was just a guy. Would Shurmur be OK with it? That's the issue...

I’d rather have David Grohl than this guy.

For me I’m thinking Shurmur or bust, but I don’t know of any realistic other alternatives. I couldn’t handle a Kafka hiring.

I'm bracing for Kafka and will do my best to get excited about it, but I'm with you - I'm all in on Shurmur being our guy.

What about Jay Gruden?

southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:17 pm I wonder if it won’t be Childress, not that I like that.

It wouldn't be my first choice, but there are worse options.

wab wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:36 am

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:29 am

This is true.

Which is why, IF Shurmur gets hired, that you can bet Nagy is giving up (or has had taken away) playcalling.

I kinda disagree. Andy Reid chucks out coaching candidates every year and he calls the plays most of the time.

Granted, Nagy doesn't have a resume that touches Reid, but as the old adage goes - there's only so many of these openings each year.

Is the old adage about your butthole, @wab?

dplank wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:48 pm

Grizzled wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:26 pm Bieniemy's not calling plays. Groh didn't call play. It's kind of split around the league. Wab is right, tho, there's only 32 OC jobs in the world, few guys will turn down the opportunity to take one.

Unfortunately, the few who would turn down that opportunity happen to be the best ones (hence, why they have the luxury to turn it down). So I'm not sure this makes me feel any better about it. We don't just need any OC, we need a good one.

Helfrich was ok with it, but he was just a guy. Would Shurmur be OK with it? That's the issue...

Yup, as expected. The best candidate goes to Denver because he gets control of the offense. God I hate the Bears, we just can't do anything right.

dplank wrote: ↑Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:46 pm

dplank wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:48 pm

Unfortunately, the few who would turn down that opportunity happen to be the best ones (hence, why they have the luxury to turn it down). So I'm not sure this makes me feel any better about it. We don't just need any OC, we need a good one.

Helfrich was ok with it, but he was just a guy. Would Shurmur be OK with it? That's the issue...

Yup, as expected. The best candidate goes to Denver because he gets control of the offense. God I hate the Bears, we just can't do anything right.

Personally, I am not very high on shurmur. Historically most of his offenses have been well into the bottom third of the league. Never understood the hype on him as he had one good fantasy run with foles magic, before the league figured out chips offense and a magical run with the vikings where he should have been buying powerball because everything Keenum threw up within 5 yards of a receiver was caught somehow.

southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 12:12 am

dplank wrote: ↑Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:46 pm

Yup, as expected. The best candidate goes to Denver because he gets control of the offense. God I hate the Bears, we just can't do anything right.

Personally, I am not very high on shurmur. Historically most of his offenses have been well into the bottom third of the league. Never understood the hype on him as he had one good fantasy run with foles magic, before the league figured out chips offense and a magical run with the vikings where he should have been buying powerball because everything Keenum threw up within 5 yards of a receiver was caught somehow.

I'm a big Shurmur fan, but I agree that the recent hype surrounding him entirely over-inflated his resume.

Didnt Pace already say in the post-season presser that Nagy will continue to call the plays on offense? just cant see anyone other than a younger OC finding that appealing in any way.

If I'm Nagy, I insist on keeping my play calling responsibilities. If I'm going to get fired, let it be on me and not someone else. But if I'm Pace, I'd insist that he give it up for exactly the same reason, and Pace is the boss. Pace's leash and Nagy's leash are probably about the same length right now. Both need to win next year or I expect them both to be gone.

I'm still not convinced that Nagy will accept an OC calling plays, especially not one who isn't totally under his thumb. He simply sees nothing wrong with his playcalling.

dplank wrote: ↑Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:46 pm

dplank wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:48 pm

Unfortunately, the few who would turn down that opportunity happen to be the best ones (hence, why they have the luxury to turn it down). So I'm not sure this makes me feel any better about it. We don't just need any OC, we need a good one.

Helfrich was ok with it, but he was just a guy. Would Shurmur be OK with it? That's the issue...

Yup, as expected. The best candidate goes to Denver because he gets control of the offense. God I hate the Bears, we just can't do anything right.

He would never control the offense with an offensive minded coach, even if Nagy gave up play calling. That’s also why high profile defensive coordinators would be more willing to come here.


Also, he gets to work with Drew Lock over Mitch Trubisky which I’m sure also makes the job more attractive. I’d certainly prefer Lock over Trubisky.

TheWorldBreaker wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:01 pm

dplank wrote: ↑Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:46 pm

Yup, as expected. The best candidate goes to Denver because he gets control of the offense. God I hate the Bears, we just can't do anything right.

He would never control the offense with an offensive minded coach, even if Nagy gave up play calling. That’s also why high profile defensive coordinators would be more willing to come here.


Also, he gets to work with Drew Lock over Mitch Trubisky which I’m sure also makes the job more attractive. I’d certainly prefer Lock over Trubisky.

That's great re: DC's wanting to come here. But for some reason we chose a guy who's defense ranked 30th in the league his last two years coaching before he got fired.

Who would you have taken over Pagano?

dplank wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:47 pm

TheWorldBreaker wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:01 pm

He would never control the offense with an offensive minded coach, even if Nagy gave up play calling. That’s also why high profile defensive coordinators would be more willing to come here.


Also, he gets to work with Drew Lock over Mitch Trubisky which I’m sure also makes the job more attractive. I’d certainly prefer Lock over Trubisky.

That's great re: DC's wanting to come here. But for some reason we chose a guy who's defense ranked 30th in the league his last two years coaching before he got fired.

He initially chose to keep Fangio on staff and Fangio agreed.

Also, in his last job he was fired as a head coach, not a DC. And his former experience as a HC was obviously part of the appeal.

Anyway, Bill Lazor is the new OC:



He has a lot of experience, I guess. And looks like Andy Dalton might be the free agent QB target.

TheWorldBreaker wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:53 pm

dplank wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:47 pm

That's great re: DC's wanting to come here. But for some reason we chose a guy who's defense ranked 30th in the league his last two years coaching before he got fired.

He initially chose to keep Fangio on staff and Fangio agreed.

Also, in his last job he was fired as a head coach, not a DC. And his former experience as a HC was obviously part of the appeal.

Anyway, Bill Lazor is the new OC:



He has a lot of experience, I guess. And looks like Andy Dalton might be the free agent QB target.

What the fuck are they thinking with this?

I am sure the interview went something like this.

Nagy - Will you do exactly what I tell you to do up in the booth and not want to call plays?
Bill - Yes sir
Nagy - Hired.

Worked under some interesting coaches:

Joe Gibbs
Mike Holmgren
Chip Kelly
Marvin Lewis
Jim Mora
Joe Philbin
Dan Reeves

There is nothing about this hire that gives me the warm fuzzies, or makes be believe that he will be anything more than a glorified offensive quality control coach. He was the OC at Miami and Cincinnati. Not exactly world beaters in the last few years.

Yes he worked under some interesting coaches, but as what? Mostly QB's coach for shitty QB's. And OC for less than two years at both stops. I thought that if Nagy could relinquish the play calling duties, he could salvage his job, and probably Pace's. Now I'm pretty sure the Bears are going to burn the whole thing down again after next year.

Next year will be same shit different season.

It has been my experience that the most successful leaders aren't afraid to hire the best that might even challenge their own knowledge of things. I've also experienced the opposite where the worst leaders hire lackeys, yes men, and people they knew previously just to create a protective bubble around themselves.

I mean, this is all incredibly speculative. Most head coaches hire the best on the opposite side of the ball that they coach and then hire and develop coaches for their scheme on their side. To claim he's just going around hiring lackeys really has no evidence. Basically seems like anyone who wasn't Shurmur was gonna get called a lackey, which is ridiculous.

The vague assumptions about Nagy and his assistants are getting a little out of control around here.