Let's look at our OL competition

[Yogi da Bear]

I think that Massie is PROBABLY our starting RT, but if Spriggs is really healthy, I will not be surprised if he beats Massie out. Probably is, but possibly isn't.

[RichH55]

I think that Massie is PROBABLY our starting RT, but if Spriggs is really healthy, I will not be surprised if he beats Massie out. Probably is, but possibly isn't.

What percentages would you put on those? Just curious

Barring Injury I think its about 95-99% that Massie is our RT personally

[cblaz11]

Agreed on Massie and I’m all on board with him being our starting RT.

Leno had arguably his worst year of his career last year but he improved as the season went on. I think 2020 can be a big year for him.

I’m more concerned with the RG position...My confidence in Coward is shot.

[Mr.Irrelevant]

Agreed on Massie and I’m all on board with him being our starting RT.

Leno had arguably his worst year of his career last year but he improved as the season went on. I think 2020 can be a big year for him.

I’m more concerned with the RG position...My confidence in Coward is shot.

I'm telling you - Ifedi's your guy. He did have a lot of trouble when playing RT, but IMHO moving him inside will solve most of his problems and his physical gifts and experience are enough to get the job done at guard.

[RichH55]

Agreed on Massie and I’m all on board with him being our starting RT.

Leno had arguably his worst year of his career last year but he improved as the season went on. I think 2020 can be a big year for him.

I’m more concerned with the RG position...My confidence in Coward is shot.

I'm telling you - Ifedi's your guy. He did have a lot of trouble when playing RT, but IMHO moving him inside will solve most of his problems and his physical gifts and experience are enough to get the job done at guard.

This might be a touch optimistic - though I'm a big believer in moving Tackles inside and watching play get magically better

One thing to remember - Ifedi as even Average - is an upgrade over the Ghost of Long and the rumor of Coward knowing what he was doing

[wab]

I'm telling you - Ifedi's your guy. He did have a lot of trouble when playing RT, but IMHO moving him inside will solve most of his problems and his physical gifts and experience are enough to get the job done at guard.

This might be a touch optimistic - though I'm a big believer in moving Tackles inside and watching play get magically better

One thing to remember - Ifedi as even Average - is an upgrade over the Ghost of Long and the rumor of Coward knowing what he was doing

Ifedi was very much an above average guard in Seattle. But they kept putting him at OT due to the revolving door.

Drafting college OT's and moving them inside is Pete's game. He does it almost every year.

James Carpenter - LT Alabama
Ryan Seymour - LT Vandy
Michael Bowie - RT Northeastern
Justin Britt - RT Mizzou
Rees Odhiambo - LT Boise St
Germain Ifedi - RT Texas A&M
Justin Senior - RT Mississippi St
Ethan Pocic - RT LSU
Phil Haynes - RT Wake Forest

Jamarco Jones and Russell Okung are literally the only two tackles drafted by Seattle that stayed at tackle. Mark Glowinski and presumably Damien Lewis are the two guards he drafted that have/will exclusively been guards.

[Yogi da Bear]

I think that Massie is PROBABLY our starting RT, but if Spriggs is really healthy, I will not be surprised if he beats Massie out. Probably is, but possibly isn't.

What percentages would you put on those? Just curious

Barring Injury I think its about 95-99% that Massie is our RT personally

It's hard to say due to Spriggs' injuries. How did the hamstring and knee injuries as a rookie affect his speed and lateral agility? How has his shoulder injury last year affected his ability to increase his strength? It's not only whether or not he's fully recovered from his injuries but also how they affected his development. There's also the training camp issues--how much will he be able to acclimate to the offense. But if he was as a rookie coming out with a full training camp, I would put it at about 40%, he would win the job outright. Right now, if I had to, I'd put it at 15-25% he wins the job with a full training camp. Those odds go down the less of a training camp we have.

[RichH55]

Fair enough Yogi - I don't think its an open competition in the least at RT


And Springgs has never been good as a Pro either

[Yogi da Bear]

Why would I care about this Springgs fellow? lol

In fairness to Spriggs, he's been dealing with a string of injuries. That's why I say his health is so important to the equation. Here's a clip that might make you fell better about how he can be if he's healthy:


The stuff that Spriggs does there, there's no way Massie can do. And did you seem him stone that guy with one hand? Damn.

[RichH55]

Not really - It's generally less than helpful to scout from Highlight Tape - Let alone one where he's playing a good amount of Guard and we are projecting him out to Tackle

I also think literally every OL we have on the roster could stop an ill-timed DB with 1 hand (if they got that hand on them) - That's why for LB and DB having a "knack" for timing the blitzes/shooting gaps is so important

Though it actually did make me feel better he had some decent snaps at Guard - I hadn't known he had played there at all

[Yogi da Bear]

I also think literally every OL we have on the roster could stop an ill-timed DB with 1 hand (if they got that hand on them) -

Well, at least you've FINALLY admitted that it's far better if your offensive guard can actually stop a DB one handed than be steamrolled by that DB like he was some sort of crepe suzette. Only took you what? 15 years? lol

[RichH55]

I also think literally every OL we have on the roster could stop an ill-timed DB with 1 hand (if they got that hand on them) -

Well, at least you've FINALLY admitted that it's far better if your offensive guard can actually stop a DB one handed than be steamrolled by that DB like he was some sort of crepe suzette. Only took you what? 15 years? lol

You don't seem to understand situations or leverage - just wow (though you only waited how many years for the dreaded no ACL to give out there for what?). If a DB decided to launch into Spriggs there he would have knocked him down

Of course then the DB would have taken himself out of the play too - Ill Timed, leverage - etc. Just wow. Wow. Wow.

I mean the stupidity of scouting an OL from a handful of snaps from one game put aside

This is the kind of stupidity where I had to spend years teaching you that Sam Acho and Jordan Matthews weren't good - and that the Defense didn't FALL APART when Shea missed a game or two

What is your Matt Barkley SHREDDED SHOULDER excuse for Backup Marriota these days by the way? Still waiting for you to admit how LOUD wrong you were there


Cmon - Whats the excuse du jour on Marriotta - I got the time, you got the crazy - So let's hear it

[Yogi da Bear]

Incidentally, it didn't only happen once Rich. It happened a few times. But at least now you finally recognize that an offensive lineman SHOULD be able to handle a DB one handed and not be run over by him. Glad to see you final come to that realization.

What do QBs have to do with the offensive line Rich? But let's talk Mariota in a separate thread after the season. I think the Titans made a big mistake.

[RichH55]

Incidentally, it didn't only happen once Rich. It happened a few times. But at least now you finally recognize that an offensive lineman SHOULD be able to handle a DB one handed and not be run over by him. Glad to see you final come to that realization.

What do QBs have to do with the offensive line Rich? But let's talk Mariota in a separate thread after the season. I think the Titans made a big mistake.

If the DB would have launched into Spriggs he would have knocked him over - with Spriggs having that level of leverage.

Most DBs and LBs. IF they had timed that right - would have blown by/through one arm of Spriggs (Spriggs is not especially powerful by OL standards - though I know you have that one highlight so I have to ignore 100% of other things)

I mean most of it is Physics - If a DB gets flat footed (like the one here) or just caught up in the trash - they already lacked the power and size - Now that speed has been taken away

But yeah - a DB decided to launch himself into Garza (and took the DB out of the play btw. - it was a net win for the Offense) and thus we have to act like Garza wasn't a pretty good player for a good chunk of time

You know - stupidity - Which for some reason you want to bring to the new home

So - Marriotta? I'm guessing your argument is Conspiracy ? Maybe the NFL hates Hawaiians? Cmon what's the nonsense reason why you weren't wrong

[Yogi da Bear]

No it wasn't a net win. Harris totally wiped Garza out and forced, I believe it was Thomas Jones, deeper and wider and it ended up being a loss on the play. It was HORRIBLE! Just HORRIBLE!

But I'm glad to see you finally realize that offensive guards should be able to stone DBs one handed rather than being obliterated by them. 15 years is a long time to hold to that delusion.

And it wasn't the only time either. I remember a few others, one safety in particular.

[RichH55]

No it wasn't a net win. Harris totally wiped Garza out and forced, I believe it was Thomas Jones, deeper and wider and it ended up being a loss on the play. It was HORRIBLE! Just HORRIBLE!

But I'm glad to see you finally realize that offensive guards should be able to stone DBs one handed rather than being obliterated by them. 15 years is a long time to hold to that delusion.

And it wasn't the only time either. I remember a few others, one safety in particular.

If you don't understand situations and physics and leverage - that's on you - It would make it more understandable why you don't see to understand OL play

But it's tough times and you have to be stupid somewhere (Oakland is local to Seattle type stuff)

Still waiting for you to show any class at all on Mariotta or Jordan Matthews

It's fine to be wrong- Even Loud Wrong - but be a man and own it

100 Dollars that Spriggs isn't the Starting RT (or LT) Starter (not on a trick play or some such nonsense) for the Bears come this season

[The Grizzly One]

Well, at least you two are mostly keeping it about OL in an OL thread.

[RichH55]

I mean scouting from Highlight tape - limited highlight tape at that - with a good chunk at Guard to boot

and then getting all giddy because a DB gets caught up in the trash, loses all his speed and takes a bad angle - so that the OL is able to achieve a successful income with 1 hand -

It's just foolish

But he hated that Garza didn't have an ACL - a position he took in 2005 - and never changed it

And somehow 8 seasons (He played 10 with the Bears - but let's be fair and note that his age 34 and 35 seasons weren't the best - i.e Quibbling) - AND even being named things like Pro Bowl alternate or getting great PFF grades (yes, yes I know it's PFF)

Didn't mean that Garza was solid.

And he brings it up now like it one of his good Calls!

*Granted when you are loud crazy wrong on Mariotta, Matt Barkley, Akili Smith - and weirdly awful wrong about Sam Acho and Jordan Matthews - Maybe being only "wrong" about Garza is a Success?

I only Accidently wounded that guy! Didn't accidently kill him this time! MEDAL PLEASE!

[Z Bear]

Roberto Garza had a Modelo commercial about him, nothing indicates success like a Mexican beer commercial.

[G08]

[Xee]

Roberto Garza had a Modelo commercial about him, nothing indicates success like a Mexican beer commercial.

I worked in a grocery story part-time while in college when he was on the team and always noticed these in the frozen aisle:



But hey, not going to fault the guy at all. If someone wants to pay me $10k to have my face on a box of frozen donuts, I'll take it.

[AZ_Bearfan]

[southdakbearfan]

I think that Massie is PROBABLY our starting RT, but if Spriggs is really healthy, I will not be surprised if he beats Massie out. Probably is, but possibly isn't.

So a failed 2nd round pick that has started 9 of 36 games he was available for out of a possible 48 and has been waived multiple times is going to beat out a guy that has started 102 out of 110 games. Talk about a terrible take.

Spriggs is a cheap flyer on a failed 2nd round talent. Best case he makes it as a backup. Most likely he is cut.

Massie will be fine not having a black hole next to him at RG.

[Yogi da Bear]

Respect Garza immensely for what he did on one knee, but, anyway you slice it, it's not good when your starting RG is perennially steamrolled by DBs. I thought that Rich had finally recognized that fact after 15 years, but apparently that would mean he was wrong 15 years ago, so he once again refuses to accept that very basic premise. Offensive lineman should NOT be punked by defensive backs. It's just not a good look at all. Apparently, Rich is back to believing that it's okay if our offensive line is a selection of five of these guys:



Oh well....

[IE]

simply the best

[RichH55]

"starting RG is perennially steamrolled by DBs. "

"perennially"

I don't think you know what that word means.

Roberto Garza was a heckuva FA signing who gave the Bears a Decade - 8 of which were Good

You were wrong about the ACL - In fairness to you - You aren't a Doctor and you don't know that much about Football

So it was always going to be hard for you to prognosticate in that area

At least you weren't Mariotta level wrong though! He's gonna change the Game!!!

[G08]

Respect Garza immensely for what he did on one knee, but, anyway you slice it, it's not good when your starting RG is perennially steamrolled by DBs. I thought that Rich had finally recognized that fact after 15 years, but apparently that would mean he was wrong 15 years ago, so he once again refuses to accept that very basic premise. Offensive lineman should NOT be punked by defensive backs. It's just not a good look at all. Apparently, Rich is back to believing that it's okay if our offensive line is a selection of five of these guys:



Oh well....

Are you talking about that game against the Panthers where Chris Harris was flying downhill and blowing up Garza play after play?

No fucking idea why I remember that game.

[RichH55]

Yes he is - He thinks that is how Garza's play was "perennially"

He is also not wrong about Matt Barkley and Mariotta because - reasons?

[dplank]

No interest in this argument, but I'll just say being wrong once doesn't mean always being wrong. I do wish folks would just take their lumps and admit it though when they are in fact wrong about something. I'm wrong all the time, see: Daniel, Chase as one example among many.

We're just fans here, it's not a big deal lol...

[RichH55]

Matt Ware for me - If I'm going to cast stones I need to remember the house I live in