Outrage Thread: March Edition

[dplank]

Ryan Pace has failed. He came to Chicago with a goal of fixing the long standing QB problem and he has failed as miserably as I could have ever imagined.

First he releases Cutler one year too soon and without a better option in hand. That option turned into FA Mike Glennon and an 18M overpay.

Next he famously blows the draft, trading up for Mitch unnecessarily and passing over two generational talents in Mahomes and Watson for good measure. Bad enough to get anyone fired, but this keeps getting worse.

I kinda wanted Andy Dalton as a stop gap last year and he could have been had for 7M. But no, Pace instead sends a 4th round pick for shitty Nick Foles? And for the cherry on top, turns around one year later and signs Dalton for 10M - another shit QB overpay.

That his legacy. Glennon, Trubisky, Foles, Dalton. And overpaying for each one of these turds along the way. That is why he will be unemployed this time next year.

[wulfy]

That is why he will be unemployed this time next year.

I don't know how you can say that with any certainty. This ownership group adores both Ryan Pace and Matt Nagy and has shown zero signs of even turning up the heat on either of them. I expect them to be back after another lackluster campaign.

[dplank]

Maybe, I doubt it. You can’t hide that track record, it absolutely should cost him his job.

[thunderspirit]

I fear you're in for some significant disappointment.

[Mikefive]

I fear you're in for some significant disappointment.

I think you're right.

[Artbest]

While ownership is enamored within pace and Nagy, neither were given extensions - both have 1 year left on their contracts after this season. Neither will be allowed to go into a lame duck campaign.

A .500 or worse record will lead to the jettisoning of the gm and head coach

[Otis Day]

There will be no playoffs this year. That should be enough to send Pace, at the least , packing. it is not his fault that Wilson or Watson were not going to be traded, but he didn't have to bring in the Red Rifle.

This organization has become more of a joke than they were.

Pace will also probably leave the cupboard bare for the next group of underachieving front office peeps and coaches.

[Grizzled]

Pace has whiffed every time he stepped up to the plate for a QB. He has made the Bears a laughingstock throughout the league. He should have been booted over the Trubisky debacle but, based on McCaskey statements, I wouldn't be surprised if he's rewarded with a contract extension. Being a fan since '63, seeing 3 or 4 great years, a few good ones, a few incredibly horrible ones, and mostly mediocre ones, I expect mediocrity to reign in 2021 once again.

[Z Bear]

Good God...back off the cliff, free agency is not over and the draft is still a month and a half away. People got WAY too excited about Watson and Wilson, but I knew neither was a realistic option. I have seen a few sources who said Pace aggressively went after Wilson but Seattle wised up and said he is not on the market. If the Bears can't land Mac Jones or Trey Lance they can still give up a day 2 pick for Darnold or Minshew. With Ifedi back they need to draft an OT to compete with him and the line will be set, nab a pass catching prospect (TE or WR) and O should be fine. The D is just missing a S to play next to Jackson and they should be better with Desai calling plays. With the limited cap space they had, that is about the best we could of hoped for this offseason.

[mmmc_35]

Why do people think ownership loves these guys?

[wab]

This seems dramatic. I don’t know what people expected.

[HurricaneBear]

This seems dramatic. I don’t know what people expected.

Watson, Trent Williams, an all pro RT in the first round, two mid round playmakers on offense that come in and are stars, and the defense returning to 2018 form with a first time DC all leading to a Super Bowl.

How dare you say that's unrealistic!

(Before anyones panties get twisted I'm mostly joking, it's the off-season it's the time of year people are unrealistic)

[dplank]

This seems dramatic. I don’t know what people expected.

Watson, Trent Williams, an all pro RT in the first round, two mid round playmakers on offense that come in and are stars, and the defense returning to 2018 form with a first time DC all leading to a Super Bowl.

How dare you say that's unrealistic!

(Before anyones panties get twisted I'm mostly joking, it's the off-season it's the time of year people are unrealistic)

Is it ok to expect ONE of those things though?

We have two glaring problems, QB and OL. And we address them with Andy Dalton and Germaine Ifedi? Fuck off Pace. You failed. There were non Watson/Russ options that I could have gotten excited about, the Red Rifle is not one of them.

[HurricaneBear]

Watson, Trent Williams, an all pro RT in the first round, two mid round playmakers on offense that come in and are stars, and the defense returning to 2018 form with a first time DC all leading to a Super Bowl.

How dare you say that's unrealistic!

(Before anyones panties get twisted I'm mostly joking, it's the off-season it's the time of year people are unrealistic)

Is it ok to expect ONE of those things though?

We have two glaring problems, QB and OL. And we address them with Andy Dalton and Germaine Ifedi? Fuck off Pace. You failed.

Your older than me so i'm assuming you've been a fan longer. Knowing our history? Kinda is wrong to expect one of those things my friend.

Wish and hope for them sure! I was hoping we'd get one of the QBs and a tackle myself. Just never expected it to happen.

But hey, if your gonna have high expectations, the off-seasons is the right time to do it! Because we all know the Bears are going to dash any hopes we have once the season is underway.

[The Marshall Plan]

Why do people think ownership loves these guys?

I think the whole Mike Ditka experience permanently scarred the McCaskeys from hiring a strong head coach.

That isn’t to blame Ditka.

But looking at every hire since there’s a pattern:

Wannstedt
Jauron
Lovie
Trestman
Fox
Nagy

None of them were elite hires. Fox was past his prime. Not once in 30 years did a founding franchise ever shoot for the moon and hire a transformational alpha male type leader. They’ve been out there to be had over the years too. I think the McCaskeys look at this franchise like a source of income and if they win great but they don’t want the headaches associated with it. That being a demanding HC and an aggressive GM with players that are prima donnas and sit on cop cars while eating Taco Bell in commercials. They want the cash flow and only get involved when the shit has completely hit the fan like with Trestman and the six game losing streak last year. In the same way they avoid the limelight by avoiding success they do so with embarrassment as well because things like that hurt the business.

[dplank]

Yep, fair enough. Been watching them since ‘83.

Did he have to over pay on top of it all? It like lending someone twenty bucks and they thank you by kicking you in the nut sack.

[dplank]

Still venting...but I want to address the full scope of the “what did you expect” crowd.

This isn’t all about Watson, Russ, or Trent Williams. It’s not. I had numerous paths forward that I could understand and get behind. One of them, the most likely one, was to just roll with Foles, build the lines, and draft a QB. There’s nothing unreasonable about that, that was fully in our ability to do.

Andy Dalton kills that because of the over pay. He’s not needed, we already have Foles. Andy Dalton is NOT a significant upgrade, I believe he’s actually a downgrade. That 10M and Ifedi s 5M could have gone towards Trent fucking Williams!!!! We could have actually had a top notch OL and drafted a QB to pair with Foles!!! I suspect most fans here would have been excited about this after the Russ thing wore off. Instead we’ve literally REGRESSED at both positions (Dalton < Mitch, Ifedi < Massie). So please stop over simplifying the complaint and painting it as being unreasonable.

The net gain on our OL at this point is: minus Massie. Fuck off Pace. The net gain in the QB room is: minus Mitch and plus Dalton. Double fuck off.

There had better be more to come.

[thunderspirit]

I'm not gonna touch the alpha BS, but I will say this: the McCaskeys want the Bears to look like the Pittsburgh Steelers -- don't usually cycle through GMs/coaches and don't usually suffer divas in their locker room. My stepdaughter was friends with the girl who dated Ted Phillips' oldest son in HS and he went to Carnegie-Mellon, in part to intern with the Steelers during college. It's what the McCaskeys want the Bears to be.

They appear to dislike the hiring process, about which they tend to deliberate, and clearly aren't in a hurry to go through it again.

[Otis Day]

Seeing what Trent Williams got, he was not going to be an option here and I am OK with that. the Bears don't have a lot of money to spend at the moment. I am not expecting much more at all.

I think the ARob thing is messed up and not really blaming anyone, but odd that more has not been done to this point to sign him long term.

If Pace is on the clock, he is not doing a very good job of saving himself.

I was walking out the door this morning with my Bears jacket on and thought, fuck that, I got to take a break from sporting the C after this shit.

Bears can't sniff the Steelers jocks and have not been able to …...ever.

[wab]

Still venting...but I want to address the full scope of the “what did you expect” crowd.

This isn’t all about Watson, Russ, or Trent Williams. It’s not. I had numerous paths forward that I could understand and get behind. One of them, the most likely one, was to just roll with Foles, build the lines, and draft a QB. There’s nothing unreasonable about that, that was fully in our ability to do.

Andy Dalton kills that because of the over pay. He’s not needed, we already have Foles. Andy Dalton is NOT a significant upgrade, I believe he’s actually a downgrade. That 10M and Ifedi s 5M could have gone towards Trent fucking Williams!!!! We could have actually had a top notch OL and drafted a QB to pair with Foles!!! I suspect most fans here would have been excited about this after the Russ thing wore off. Instead we’ve literally REGRESSED at both positions (Dalton < Mitch, Ifedi < Massie). So please stop over simplifying the complaint and painting it as being unreasonable.

The net gain on our OL at this point is: minus Massie. Fuck off Pace. The net gain in the QB room is: minus Mitch and plus Dalton. Double fuck off.

There had better be more to come.

The Bears got no better or no worse. Then net gain/loss is zero.

Also... the Bears are in no position to make a 32 year old the highest paid OL in history. So that 15mil wouldn't have gotten them very far

[dplank]

Seeing what Trent Williams got, he was not going to be an option here and I am OK with that. the Bears don't have a lot of money to spend at the moment. I am not expecting much more at all.

I think the ARob thing is messed up and not really blaming anyone, but odd that more has not been done to this point to sign him long term.

If Pace is on the clock, he is not doing a very good job of saving himself.

I was walking out the door this morning with my Bears jacket on and thought, fuck that, I got to take a break from sporting the C after this shit.

Bears can't sniff the Steelers jocks and have not been able to …...ever.

Disagree. 6yr/123M is 23M a year on average, and you know it's setup where there's less hit early and outs later in the contract. It was totally affordable, we probably could have had him for exactly what we spent on Dalton/Ifedi. And on a go forward basis with Leno/Massie off the books he'd be a high end LT pay wise, which is exactly what he should be, but nothing ridiculous or cap killing at all.

[The Marshall Plan]

Some people may think the alpha HC is a BS concept but it’s real. A name. Somebody where you go holy shit we hired that guy. Instead it’s usually a coordinator that got promoted or an old man looking for one last payday before retirement.

That speaks volumes to the culture of the front office.

To @dplank ‘s point there is a massive air of bullshit and then incompetence on Pace’s part.

How many QBs has Mr. Draft A QB Every Year taken in his time as GM? He’s full of shit and negligent.

Then for the past two years the OL has been a problem. No one can argue that. But if it isn’t not landing Williams, it’s Jack Conklin. It’s being content with investing a #2 overall pick on a QB in Mitch and then failing to surround him with talent. OK fine Pace got ARob and he should be commended for that. Where’s the OL? The TE? The glue hands possession guy?

The frustration comes in trading away a 1,000 yard rusher in Jordan Howard or in tolerating Leno and Massie for years. Letting the interior OL turn into jello over the years. Setting people up for failure.

I know Mitch has his flaws, but if we’re going to be honest with ourselves he was at least in part setup for failure. That’s on Pace.

[Otis Day]

Did you ever think he may not have wanted to leave SF? That is a much better team there, closer to the SB than the Bears are. You have to take that into account.

[HurricaneBear]

Some people may think the alpha HC is a BS concept but it’s real. A name. Somebody where you go holy shit we hired that guy. Instead it’s usually a coordinator that got promoted or an old man looking for one last payday before retirement.

That speaks volumes to the culture of the front office.

You mean like how they should have hired Bruce Arians instead of Marc Trestman? That shit still gets me pissed off.

[HurricaneBear]

Still venting...but I want to address the full scope of the “what did you expect” crowd.

This isn’t all about Watson, Russ, or Trent Williams. It’s not. I had numerous paths forward that I could understand and get behind. One of them, the most likely one, was to just roll with Foles, build the lines, and draft a QB. There’s nothing unreasonable about that, that was fully in our ability to do.

You'll hear no arguments from me on this. If they couldn't get Wilson/Watson/Carr, the next thing should have just been to build the lines and add speed to the offense(ok, we disagree on drafting a QB in this scenario but thats minor).

But at the same time it's the Bears. My first reaction to signing Andy Dalton was to laugh because it's the most Bears thing to do.

When other teams trade for a QB they get Matt Stafford. When the Bears do its Rick Mirer or Nick Foles.

When other teams sign a free agent QB it's Peyton Manning or Tom Brady or Philip Rivers. When the Bears do it's Mike Glennon or Andy Dalton.

It's just what life as a Bears fan is. Be happy you at least got to watch the Super Bowl. I was 2 at the time. The Bears are who we thought they were, and they ain't gonna change.

[wulfy]

To me, the bigger issue with the organization is Philosophic. They adore the image of the Monsters of the Midway - tough defenses who play in "Bear Weather" and stifle the flummoxed opposing QB. And they love their RBs - images of Walter Payton, Gale Sayers and Matt Forte dance through their heads. That is what the NFL looks like to them. And it's why they have invested 2/3rds of their cap in the Defense (and a significant amount of their draft capital) and always make sure the RB position is well stocked.

It's also why they haven't properly cared for the QB position - they took a massive swing with Mitch who is now the Sam Bowie of the NFL (at least Sam had an injury to blame). But in his formative years surrounded him with QB whispers like Dowell Loggains, Dave Ragone and John Fox. Jury is out on Matt Nagy - but early returns look like he doesn't know how to develop a QB either. And THAT stability at QB is the significant difference between the Steelers (who I agree, they idolize) and the Bears.

Pace and Nagy's consequences for an INCREDIBLY disappointing 2019 and a year of Bum-Slaying in 2020 was: Nothing. As it stands right now, this is probably a 6 win team .... for Phillips/George to return Pace and Nagy after that will take elephant balls. We'll see.

I'm cheering for reduced capacity at games so I get some money back on my season tickets.

[HurricaneBear]

To me, the bigger issue with the organization is Philosophic. They adore the image of the Monsters of the Midway - tough defenses who play in "Bear Weather" and stifle the flummoxed opposing QB. And they love their RBs - images of Walter Payton, Gale Sayers and Matt Forte dance through their heads. That is what the NFL looks like to them. And it's why they have invested 2/3rds of their cap in the Defense (and a significant amount of their draft capital) and always make sure the RB position is well stocked.

It's also why they haven't properly cared for the QB position - they took a massive swing with Mitch who is now the Sam Bowie of the NFL (at least Sam had an injury to blame). But in his formative years surrounded him with QB whispers like Dowell Loggains, Dave Ragone and John Fox. Jury is out on Matt Nagy - but early returns look like he doesn't know how to develop a QB either. And THAT stability at QB is the significant difference between the Steelers (who I agree, they idolize) and the Bears.

don't think anyone could have said it any better. maybe one day they will figure it out?

[WagonForce]

I keep thinking Pace got extended. The weird evasiveness around his contract during the end of year presser didn't make sense to me, unless the team was already concerned about PR (remember George's impromptu radio tour?) and knew they could create a firestorm with the announcement. Nagy also seemed strangely confident when facing questions about his job during the worst stretch last season.

I don't believe this ownership group wants to look for a new GM.

[The Marshall Plan]

Some people may think the alpha HC is a BS concept but it’s real. A name. Somebody where you go holy shit we hired that guy. Instead it’s usually a coordinator that got promoted or an old man looking for one last payday before retirement.

That speaks volumes to the culture of the front office.

You mean like how they should have hired Bruce Arians instead of Marc Trestman? That shit still gets me pissed off.

Yes.

Bruce Arians
Dave McGinnis

Not going after Jim Harbaugh.

Not going after and landing a big name coach from at least college.

Over the past 30 years there have been names and opportunities out there and the McCaskeys sit back, settle for mediocrity, and fill in a name on an org chart for HC.

[Grizzled]

Yes, it was pretty unrealistic to expect the Seahawks to actually part with Wilson. Watson prefers the Jets and Dolphins as destinations and they have much more to offer the Texans if they pull the trigger on a trade for him. But, c'mon, in what universe does Andy Dalton improve the Bears much more than Foles? Especially at $10M? Tyrod Taylor got $6M from the Texans. Jacoby Brissett got $7.5M from the Dolphins. Either would have been at least as good as Dalton/Foles and Brissett probably better. Darnold and Minshew might be available via trade but the QB situation is already a quagmire, can't see them adding either as Pace apparently thought more of Dalton. The odds were slim for Pace to improve the QB situation in the off-season and he didn't . He didn't improve a situation he's totally resposible for. And management just goes along with this bumbling.