The Scouting Continues - Eagles vs. Bucs

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We play the Bucs week 7, in TB.

Watching the Eagles vs. Bucs. He's the GOAT for a reason. He just picks apart secondaries. But it looks as though they don't have much of a running game. The Bucs secondary is REALLY banged up, and they just lost their new signing Richard Sherman to a hamstring injury. It will be interesting to see what the Bucs run defense is like. I think it's pretty stout.
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You just can't rush more than four against Brady. He will destroy you. And for the love of God, don't blitz him. He's got some receiving weapons, but Fournette is not lighting it up against the Eagles. However I'm not sure making the Bucs a one dimensional passing team is going to help you much.
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Only way to beat Brady is to hit him repeatedly and rattle him. You saw him come unhinged against us last year, Khalil Mack was in his head.

If you can get home with 4 and zone him out on the back, mix it up with man from time-to-time, you'll have a puncher's chance.
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The Eagles actually had an excellent yards per carry. Jalen Hurts was < 50% in accuracy. The Eagles have been running less and less each week and the QB can't carry them.
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Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:44 am The Eagles actually had an excellent yards per carry. Jalen Hurts was < 50% in accuracy. The Eagles have been running less and less each week and the QB can't carry them.
I don't think Hurts was the right choice at all. I think the Eagles really missed the mark with deciding he was the franchise QB.
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I really love Jalen Hurts. He's still young and green and they have a young team especially receivers and the Oline is really bad. Sanders has been bad but sprung some last night (I think when they really weren't expecting the Eagles to run). Hurts reminds me of Lamar 3 years ago where he's just really green and living off of his athleticism. He has some accuracy but as he showed last night throws to the wrong spot... looks like stuff he can fix. Reagor missed at least 2 catchable balls last night. I think he'll grow into a better QB and less an athlete. He might not - but after a half a season of NFL starts I'm not ready to say he's not an NFL starter. Even without much surrounding experienced cast (other than his TE), he's putting up 300 yards a game personally (250 pass/50 rush). Thats... actually pretty impressive.
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:39 pm You just can't rush more than four against Brady. He will destroy you. And for the love of God, don't blitz him. He's got some receiving weapons, but Fournette is not lighting it up against the Eagles. However I'm not sure making the Bucs a one dimensional passing team is going to help you much.
This is important to note when discussing our QB play IMHO.

It's a very important thing for NFL QBs to develop
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:09 pm We play the Bucs week 7, in TB.

Watching the Eagles vs. Bucs. He's the GOAT for a reason. He just picks apart secondaries. But it looks as though they don't have much of a running game. The Bucs secondary is REALLY banged up, and they just lost their new signing Richard Sherman to a hamstring injury. It will be interesting to see what the Bucs run defense is like. I think it's pretty stout.
It's The GOAT.

We aren't beating him. I don't care what happened last year. Brady just isn't stopping. He's the Jason Voorhees of the NFL. You aren't beating him.

While watching the pre-game one of the analysts said that Brady has had three HOF QB careers in his single career. He's had 3 different five year spans that matched Jim Kelly, Troy Aikman and I forget the third guy.

Our secondary is no good. We might be able to get to The GOAT with 4 guys given that Mack is one of them and Quinn is having a good year, but are they going to get to him every play? No.
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:26 am
Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:44 am The Eagles actually had an excellent yards per carry. Jalen Hurts was < 50% in accuracy. The Eagles have been running less and less each week and the QB can't carry them.
I don't think Hurts was the right choice at all. I think the Eagles really missed the mark with deciding he was the franchise QB.
The one thing I read is you can't teach accuracy. He was alright in college but is only a 58% passer in the pros. The Eagles have Minshew as their backup, will they go to him if they don't start winning? Another team which traded out of a chance for Fields, some regret there?
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Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:34 pm
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:26 am

I don't think Hurts was the right choice at all. I think the Eagles really missed the mark with deciding he was the franchise QB.
The one thing I read is you can't teach accuracy. He was alright in college but is only a 58% passer in the pros. The Eagles have Minshew as their backup, will they go to him if they don't start winning? Another team which traded out of a chance for Fields, some regret there?
Aren't we still working our way up to 58% in the pros ourselves?

Perhaps just a touch early for other teams to feel sturm und drang over it?
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IE wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:40 am I really love Jalen Hurts. He's still young and green and they have a young team especially receivers and the Oline is really bad.


Eagles rank 9th in the NFL in terms of Pass Block Win Rate

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/321 ... s#pbwrteam

The OL is not the problem
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RichH55 wrote: Sat Oct 16, 2021 2:58 pm
Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:34 pm

The one thing I read is you can't teach accuracy. He was alright in college but is only a 58% passer in the pros. The Eagles have Minshew as their backup, will they go to him if they don't start winning? Another team which traded out of a chance for Fields, some regret there?
Aren't we still working our way up to 58% in the pros ourselves?

Perhaps just a touch early for other teams to feel sturm und drang over it?
Can't ever really know what other teams are thinking, just my supposition. I believe Fields is a much better passer than Hurts.
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Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:34 pm
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:26 am

I don't think Hurts was the right choice at all. I think the Eagles really missed the mark with deciding he was the franchise QB.
The one thing I read is you can't teach accuracy. He was alright in college but is only a 58% passer in the pros. The Eagles have Minshew as their backup, will they go to him if they don't start winning? Another team which traded out of a chance for Fields, some regret there?
Dude... Justin Fields is a career 51.4% passer in the pros.
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@RichH55 Don't ever bother responding to me - you're blocked and I don't read any of your sad unworthy shit.
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IE wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:53 am
Grizzled wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:34 pm

The one thing I read is you can't teach accuracy. He was alright in college but is only a 58% passer in the pros. The Eagles have Minshew as their backup, will they go to him if they don't start winning? Another team which traded out of a chance for Fields, some regret there?
Dude... Justin Fields is a career 51.4% passer in the pros.
Better today although hardly a noteworthy game. I'll take him over Jalen Hurts.
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IE wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:55 am @RichH55 Don't ever bother responding to me - you're blocked and I don't read any of your sad unworthy shit.
Sorry for bringing Facts into it.

My Bad?
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Grizzled wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:25 pm
IE wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:53 am

Dude... Justin Fields is a career 51.4% passer in the pros.
Better today although hardly a noteworthy game. I'll take him over Jalen Hurts.
I would too!

Its kind of damning with faint praise though
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RichH55 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 5:06 pm
Grizzled wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:25 pm
Better today although hardly a noteworthy game. I'll take him over Jalen Hurts.
I would too!

Its kind of damning with faint praise though
LOL. Takes time to learn the NFL game, give Justin a full season.
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Grizzled wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:11 pm
RichH55 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 5:06 pm

I would too!

Its kind of damning with faint praise though
LOL. Takes time to learn the NFL game, give Justin a full season.
And not this year - Ferrari in the garage - Training Wheels still very much on

Year 2 will mean so so much more

The concern - the getting the ball out is always slow - college, preseason, and current
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RichH55 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:13 pm
Grizzled wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:11 pm

LOL. Takes time to learn the NFL game, give Justin a full season.
And not this year - Ferrari in the garage - Training Wheels still very much on

Year 2 will mean so so much more

The concern - the getting the ball out is always slow - college, preseason, and current
That should be fixable. Accuracy for some reason isn't unless you're throwing only checkdowns.
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Grizzled wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 4:34 pm
RichH55 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:13 pm

And not this year - Ferrari in the garage - Training Wheels still very much on

Year 2 will mean so so much more

The concern - the getting the ball out is always slow - college, preseason, and current
That should be fixable. Accuracy for some reason isn't unless you're throwing only checkdowns.
Why is it fixable is my question?

Get better? Yes (right now he has to be in the absolute bottom % in terms of holding the ball) - but getting from terrible to bad is not fixed in that regard

Yes - tOSU loves offensive concepts that take time (and are more talented than anyone they play who isn't Alabama) - But Fields was the 4th worst in the nation in terms of holding the ball in College last year

The odds that ever gets to "average" by NFL standards - are not overly great
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RichH55 wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 6:44 pm
Grizzled wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 4:34 pm

That should be fixable. Accuracy for some reason isn't unless you're throwing only checkdowns.
Why is it fixable is my question?

Get better? Yes (right now he has to be in the absolute bottom % in terms of holding the ball) - but getting from terrible to bad is not fixed in that regard

Yes - tOSU loves offensive concepts that take time (and are more talented than anyone they play who isn't Alabama) - But Fields was the 4th worst in the nation in terms of holding the ball in College last year

The odds that ever gets to "average" by NFL standards - are not overly great
Can only hope the right coach/coaches can develop better habits from Fields.
Drafts are like snowflakes, no two are alike.
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RichH55 wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 6:44 pm
Grizzled wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 4:34 pm

That should be fixable. Accuracy for some reason isn't unless you're throwing only checkdowns.
Why is it fixable is my question?

Get better? Yes (right now he has to be in the absolute bottom % in terms of holding the ball) - but getting from terrible to bad is not fixed in that regard

Yes - tOSU loves offensive concepts that take time (and are more talented than anyone they play who isn't Alabama) - But Fields was the 4th worst in the nation in terms of holding the ball in College last year

The odds that ever gets to "average" by NFL standards - are not overly great
It's entirely possible that OSU didn't focus that much on having him get the ball out faster. At OSU it was generally one big scramble drill because the passing offense was primarily designed around chunk plays. IMO that's what I see him doing now...going for the kill with every pass. He's missed nearly every checkdown opportunity presented to him because he's going for the big play. On one hand, you like that attitude, but on the other he needs to learn to take what he's being given. Just more things that point to him not really being ready.

Another thing that doesn't get mentioned much, if at all, is that his upper body mechanics need some work. When he's on the move he can zip it with a flick of his wrist. But when he's standing in the pocket, he's got a long windup. Almost Byron Leftwich-y. I think that's made him late on some throws.
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wab wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 9:55 am
RichH55 wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 6:44 pm

Why is it fixable is my question?

Get better? Yes (right now he has to be in the absolute bottom % in terms of holding the ball) - but getting from terrible to bad is not fixed in that regard

Yes - tOSU loves offensive concepts that take time (and are more talented than anyone they play who isn't Alabama) - But Fields was the 4th worst in the nation in terms of holding the ball in College last year

The odds that ever gets to "average" by NFL standards - are not overly great
It's entirely possible that OSU didn't focus that much on having him get the ball out faster. At OSU it was generally one big scramble drill because the passing offense was primarily designed around chunk plays. IMO that's what I see him doing now...going for the kill with every pass. He's missed nearly every checkdown opportunity presented to him because he's going for the big play. On one hand, you like that attitude, but on the other he needs to learn to take what he's being given. Just more things that point to him not really being ready.

Another thing that doesn't get mentioned much, if at all, is that his upper body mechanics need some work. When he's on the move he can zip it with a flick of his wrist. But when he's standing in the pocket, he's got a long windup. Almost Byron Leftwich-y. I think that's made him late on some throws.
Love big plays.

They are easier when your OL is better than the other side - Your HB is averaging 7.5 YPC (not made up), and your best 2 WR are night and day better than the guys on the other side (Deep ball accuracy is a lot easier when the guy is 5 yards open)

Granted - all those things would help in the Pros too - but if you have that - Why can't you win with an Andy Dalton type?
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