Should OT rules be amended?

[The Cooler King]

We gotta have a thread on this right?

Is the current sudden death by TD rules good for the game or should the NFL consider further changes?

[Bears Whiskey Nut]

Yes! Regular season, the rules can be the same. Playoffs have to be different. Both teams are gassed. If the first team drives down and scores a TD, the other team should get one more possession to try and do the same.

[wab]

I think each team should get a chance to score. I don't think how they score should matter either. Play until the other team scores more points, or doesn't score on their possession.

[Z Bear]

No, the rules are fine right now. The Bills defense had several chances to stop KC in overtime and they didn't, moreso in the end of regulation. No way should you let a team drive for a FG in 13 seconds. The rules are already skewed enough for the offense, no need to change the overtime rules to give both offenses a chance. Football is a team sport and all facets of said team need to excel to be a contender.

[Boris13c]

I think playoff OT should be a 10 minute extra period , so unless the team possessing first uses all 10 minutes, both teams would have a chance at possession in OT

[Otis Day]

No, the rules are fine right now. The Bills defense had several chances to stop KC in overtime and they didn't, moreso in the end of regulation. No way should you let a team drive for a FG in 13 seconds. The rules are already skewed enough for the offense, no need to change the overtime rules to give both offenses a chance. Football is a team sport and all facets of said team need to excel to be a contender.

Couldn't agree more. If that was not an epic game, the OT rule would not be discussed today.

[The Cooler King]

So my current thinking is I somewhat disagree that equal possession should necessarily be guaranteed. Afterall, it is a timed game and not a strictly equal possession game such as baseball is.

That said, I really hate that a coin flip plays such a determining factor. At least with the beginning of game coin flip, the KO swaps at half. So each team had basically equal chance that they might gain the possession edge. And sometimes a game ends with one team getting an extra possession at the end of regulation and winning by a score. And no one says the opponent gets a right to respond there.

So I think there are two possibilities that remove a coin flip from having such a big say.

1. Play a timed extra possession that continues on from the last spot. As some have noted, KC got back to back possessions on the total basis of luck. Kind of arbitrary. This would have some impact on decision making with the clock but teams will be still heavily incentivized to score in regulation. But if they don't, you keep playing. If they end up scoring in the opening minutes of OT, team B then has plenty of time to respond. The hard part would be determining whats a logical application of time outs and clock stoppages. Most teams try to enter the last 5 minutes of regulation with as many TO as possible so they can force a field flip.
2. Play a timed extra period, but split into halves. Rather than continuation, you start fresh with a new coin flip and each team recieiving at a half. Respects the idea of a clock being significant and also doesn't alter late game clock management during regulation. But maybe a lengthier time commitment.

I just hate something like college OT which changes fundamental parts of the game. And any change geared towards a guarantee of equal possession removes too much of the timed element of the game.

[TheWorldBreaker]

No, the rules are fine right now. The Bills defense had several chances to stop KC in overtime and they didn't, moreso in the end of regulation. No way should you let a team drive for a FG in 13 seconds. The rules are already skewed enough for the offense, no need to change the overtime rules to give both offenses a chance. Football is a team sport and all facets of said team need to excel to be a contender.

The issue is that the Kansas City defense didn’t look like they could stop Allen either but didn’t have to because of a coin flip.

So essentially a coin flip decided the game. And it’s a bummer that Allen was almost perfect but lost the game without ever touching the ball in overtime.

In the regular season I think this is fine (because you don’t want to play forever when both teams have games the next week) but for the playoffs I wouldn’t mind if it was like other sports where you play the entire time period until there is a winner.

No one can honestly say if the game continued and Allen got the ball anyone would have turned away.

[Z Bear]

The coin flip justs decides who gets the ball first, it is still the teams' job to go out and win the game. It is a team sport, not just the best offense. The fact of the matter is the Bills had a really good D that failed at the most inopputune time (13 seconds left with a 3 point lead). If their D had stepped up the coin flip would not have taken place. Making sure both offenses get the ball is just another participation trophy.

[dplank]

I'm kind of ok with the rules as they are now. The one change I'd make is extending the OT to a full 15 minutes though. Tie's suck and teams run the clock in OT - there's typically 2-3 possessions and it's over. Not an issue in the playoffs.

[WagonForce]

A friend and I argue about this regularly. For the longest time I've told him, "the rules are fine, you had chances all game to win it in regulation, if you let the opponent drive the length of the field and score a TD in OT you lose, that's it". He disagrees and finds it silly that the opposing team can be denied a chance to respond.

Last night's game, for the first time, has me thinking that maybe these rules need changing. The league is so heavily slanted in favor of the offense now, a lot does seem to hang on a simple coin flip. It feels like more and more of these overtime games end this way. Does anyone think the Chiefs would have stopped the Bills if they had been given a possession to answer? I sure don't.

[Xee]

No, the rules are fine right now. The Bills defense had several chances to stop KC in overtime and they didn't, moreso in the end of regulation. No way should you let a team drive for a FG in 13 seconds. The rules are already skewed enough for the offense, no need to change the overtime rules to give both offenses a chance. Football is a team sport and all facets of said team need to excel to be a contender.

The issue is in the playoffs, when the teams are the best of the best, its pretty much guaranteed that the team who wins the coin toss will win the game. Since the new OT rules in 2011, 11 playoff games have gone into overtime. Of those games, the team that got the ball first has won 10 times.

[TheWorldBreaker]

The coin flip justs decides who gets the ball first, it is still the teams' job to go out and win the game. It is a team sport, not just the best offense. The fact of the matter is the Bills had a really good D that failed at the most inopputune time (13 seconds left with a 3 point lead). If their D had stepped up the coin flip would not have taken place. Making sure both offenses get the ball is just another participation trophy.

It is a team sport but under the current rule structure a game can end with only half the team playing. So it’s better to be lucky than good.

Having to play the entire period isn’t a participation trophy, it’s just more football and how most major sports handle their overtime situations.

[Z Bear]

No they do not; NHL is sudden death, MLS soccer is golden goal, same with most European leagues (Worldcup is different though and many people are wanting to go back to golden goal). NBA is such a high scoring game and the possesions are so short you could not have first score winner rule. Conversely with baseball it is so low scoring you could need several extra innings to win.

[Moriarty]

No, the rules are fine right now. The Bills defense had several chances to stop KC in overtime and they didn't, moreso in the end of regulation. No way should you let a team drive for a FG in 13 seconds. The rules are already skewed enough for the offense, no need to change the overtime rules to give both offenses a chance. Football is a team sport and all facets of said team need to excel to be a contender.

The issue is in the playoffs, when the teams are the best of the best, its pretty much guaranteed that the team who wins the coin toss will win the game. Since the new OT rules in 2011, 11 playoff games have gone into overtime. Of those games, the team that got the ball first has won 10 times.

Yeah.
Luck as the primary determining factor in a playoff game is a crappy system.

[TheWorldBreaker]

No they do not; NHL is sudden death, MLS soccer is golden goal, same with most European leagues (Worldcup is different though and many people are wanting to go back to golden goal). NBA is such a high scoring game and the possesions are so short you could not have first score winner rule. Conversely with baseball it is so low scoring you could need several extra innings to win.

The NHL and soccer aren’t really major sports in America (at least based on ratings) and both of those sports have everyone on both sides of the ball/puck on the field of the play, so a coin toss doesn’t determine the outcome of their overtime periods over 90% of the time while half the teams sit and watch.

I also think the NHL’s overtime rules are a little more complex than that since they also utilize shootouts as part of their overtime rules. At least they used to I haven’t watched an NHL game in a long time.

[Z Bear]

NHL is sudden death 5 min period, if no one scoes then they go to shootout.

[IE]

I like pure, sudden death (lol).

It's a sport - a 60 minute game with 100-140 plays that they either earn, allow or prevent... each one an opportunity to make the difference on both offense and defense. I think if teams blow a lot of those opportunities earlier and manage a tie, they deserve to have their fate decided by a coin flip. If they came from behind to tie it after making earlier mistakes, or if they had a lead and blew it. Either way they don't deserve one more series of plays.

Then afterward they shake hands and say "good job old chap - looking forward to next time".

[dplank]

How about the 10 minute OT period, both teams get to possess the ball once by rule, and if it ends tied after 10 minutes then you do footballs version of a shootout, which is the college thing where you start teams off near the red zone and go until someone outscores the other. They might still be playing in KC right now lol.

[Hema2.0]

This isnt baseball. You cant continue to give equal possessions. In every scenario, whether it's a 10 min quarter or possessions to both teams you run the risk of continuous ties and major injuries to both teams. Keep it the way it is.

[The Cooler King]

The coin flip justs decides who gets the ball first, it is still the teams' job to go out and win the game. It is a team sport, not just the best offense. The fact of the matter is the Bills had a really good D that failed at the most inopputune time (13 seconds left with a 3 point lead). If their D had stepped up the coin flip would not have taken place. Making sure both offenses get the ball is just another participation trophy.

Historical precedence shows us that first possession is pretty impactful though.



I'm opposed to any arguement that starts with the assumption that each team needs equal possession, so I tend to agree its a team game with two sides. The game has never been a true equal possession game and in fact we effectively see strategy employed by teams to create a possession edge at end of games. To act like being on O or D is equal chance when a score wins it, but a stop doesn't is kind of silly though.

That said, every game does fall within a 1 possession edge (unless a team effs up the coin toss and elected to kick on a deferral). If the game ends with the winning team scoring on the final possession, which gives them a possession edge, no one questions if the other team deserves a chance to respond.

However if we look at last nights game, KC actually ends up with a 2 possession edge in the game (granted one was a 13 second possession, and another a 37 second one at the end of the half). But in the flow of the game there is a lot of built in strategy with clock mgmt and skill with execution that leads to any possession edge. In the case of an OT coin flip its just total luck. Why shouldn't we just do a continuation instead of literally flipping 50% for possession? At least in hockey, with sudden death where you could win the face off and posses the entire time and score, the other team had the same athletic chance to do the same. But a coin flip?! Dang.

[The Cooler King]

This isnt baseball. You cant continue to give equal possessions. In every scenario, whether it's a 10 min quarter or possessions to both teams you run the risk of continuous ties and major injuries to both teams. Keep it the way it is.

I generally agree except KC actually got two extra possession in the game (granted two were short end of half ones). That possession edge came down to a coin flip, not any sort of athletic competetive edge.

So I definitely don't wanna see a college, equal trade of possessions scenario, but a coin flip and sudden death leaves A LOT to a coin flip chance.

[Z Bear]

Ohhh, I got it!!!!! Thanks Cooler for mentioning face off.

Have possession settled like they do in Austrailian rules football. Ref bounces the ball off the ground and each team is allowed one guy within 10 yards of the face off. The other players can shoot towards midfield as soon as the ball hits the ground. The jumpers can bat the ball either way, but first person that is not a jumper who gets possession secures possesion for his team at that spot. Keep the first score must be a TD rule though.

[The Cooler King]

Ohhh, I got it!!!!! Thanks Cooler for mentioning face off.

Have possession settled like they do in Austrailian rules football. Ref bounces the ball off the ground and each team is allowed one guy within 10 yards of the face off. The other players can shoot towards midfield as soon as the ball hits the ground. The jumpers can bat the ball either way, but first person that is not a jumper who gets possession secures possesion for his team at that spot. Keep the first score must be a TD rule though.

Better than a coin flip I guess . Though would be better if it was already a relatable football skill. Also, might need to swap out the ball as Aussie rules football has a much more natural bounce to it than an NFL ball.

[Z Bear]

The awkward bounces will make it that much more interesting! Will lead to a lot of refs possibly fixing the bounces though.

[The Cooler King]

As much as I love OTs that don't change game fundamentals the first two proposals from this article keep sudden death, but leave the chance over first ball to some level of strategy instead of luck. The first has already been written up. And the home team would get "first choice" I think, rather than a coin flip determining first choice. Especially in the playoffs, home team has at least earned first choice by their reg season play.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/thre ... -scrutiny/

Analytics could be all over these decisions!

[Otis Day]

NHL is sudden death 5 min period, if no one scoes then they go to shootout.

Playoffs do not use the shootout though. They play put 20 minutes on the clock and play until someone scores. If no score, intermission and another 20 min period.

Playoff hockey is the shit.

[The Cooler King]

NHL is sudden death 5 min period, if no one scoes then they go to shootout.

Playoffs do not use the shootout though. They play put 20 minutes on the clock and play until someone scores. If no score, intermission and another 20 min period.

Playoff hockey is the shit.

I can't remember, do they do the reduction to 4 skaters after the first OT or is that international play?

[The Cooler King]

Also my perhaps most controversial AND European take is that ties are fine and we should end games in regulation during the regular season.

[Ditka’s dictaphone]

Given those stats from Xee it’s clear the contest is skewed.
Perhaps that puts more importance on the potential kicking team to avoid OT?

Seems like there are 2 options to avoid damaging the spectacle - i) 1 more possession after your opponents score first ii) play until 1 team is more than 8 points (1 score) ahead.