Update: Kareem Hunt signs w/ Browns

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Seems like this player is going to be talked about more this offseason. So he deserved his own topic.

I just heard part of a discussion of him on the radio this morning with Adam Schefter. They were specifically talking about his getting an NFL conduct suspension. Scheftie was saying that potentially, this could be handled by the NFL like some past situation some years back, where they gave him "time served" based on the games lost since he was cut. But he also pointed out that the NFL seemingly has an ongoing investigation into not only that incident, but the two other reported incidents. So expect at least 6 games out to come from the NFL. He didn't seem to think that "time served" would be the route the NFL would go with this, although it's possible.

That's what I heard anyway.


It looks like the question becomes, is it worth signing him if he's only going to play 8-10 regular season games?
Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.
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^ Yes absolutely he is. Howard is out of contract after the 2019 season and he's not coming back, IMO.

I don't think much is going to come out of those other two altercations. There are no police reports or charges pressed, investigation or not how can you punish someone for something that is viewed as a crime by the county/state?

I think he'll still get 6 games and MAYBE could contest it down to 4 (time-served), but who knows how Goodell will be feeling that day.
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IF he is getting his act together, and is seeking personal help, and committing to do so for a continued time period, than he is absolutely worth it from a talent and scheme fit perspective.

My question for the rest of you is this: would chicago have to pick up his rookie contract with the Chiefs or is that void? If it is void, then whomever signs him can get a nice 4-5 year deal cheaper than his talent is worth because of the risk he brings.
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VA_Mountain_Bear wrote:IF he is getting his act together, and seeking personal help, and committing to do so for a continued time period, than he is absolutely worth it from a talent and scheme fit perspective.

My question for the rest of you is this: would chicago have to pick up his rookie contract with the Chiefs or is that void? If it is void, then whomever signs him can get a nice 4-5 year deal cheaper than his talent is worth because of the risk he brings.
He was cut and cleared waivers. He officially has no contract to pick up.
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ESPN reporter Lisa Salters was at a Dave & Busters outside Philadelphia with her five-year-old son Saturday night when she got a call: She needed to be in Kansas City the next morning to interview former Chiefs running back Kareem Hunt. Hunt was released last week after TMZ published a video of him abusing and kicking a woman; his representatives had reached out to ESPN to arrange a sit-down and requested Salters be the interviewer. In the 10-minute segment that aired Sunday morning, Hunt told Salters that the NFL had not reached out to him as part of its investigation of the incident and that he is planning on seeking counseling for his behavior. He said over and over that he was sorry, but offered few specifics on the night of the incident.

The Washington Post talked to Salters, who has been ESPN’s “Monday Night Football” sideline reporter for the past seven years, about how she prepped for the interview on short notice, her impressions of what Hunt said and how her background as a news reporter — she covered the O.J. Simpson trial for ABC News — guided her approach. The following transcript has been edited for length and clarity.

The Post: How did the interview come together?

Lisa Salters: Kareem and his people reached out to ESPN, I’m not exactly sure who. I got a call at 5:30 [Saturday night] — I was at a video arcade with my five-and-a-half-year-old son — saying, “We need you to get on a flight to Kansas City because he has requested he only wants to do this interview with you.”

The Post: Why did he request you?

Salters: I’ve been doing “Monday Night Football” for seven years now, so when he came into the league I did a couple of interviews with him for Monday night games. I think we had the Chiefs three times last year. So I’ve spoken to him before, but we’re not friends or anything like that. I think he felt that — I don’t know, I can’t speak for him.

The Post: Where did you film the interview?

Salters: In his apartment.

The Post: Were there any parameters? Anything you agreed not to ask?

Salters: No, they said, “We know you’re going to ask a lot of hard questions, and he’s prepared to answer all of them.”

The Post: How did you prepare? Did you talk to news reporters or domestic-violence experts?

Salters: There’s a research department at ESPN, but there is specifically a news editor that works with us every week for “Monday Night Football.” He’s the backbone of the Monday night family; his name is Jim Carr. He was the person I wanted to reach out. . . . My biggest concern was logistics. I had a lot of balls in the air. Had to get my son to his grandparents, and I had to get to the airport in like three hours. . . . So in the airport lounge in Philadelphia I had 20 minutes before the flight took off and we touched base. . . . Then just on the plane, I formulated an outline of where I wanted to go in my head. But me and Jim Carr pulled it together.

The Post: Considering that you were a news reporter — in Baltimore and then for ABC News — how helpful was the background for an interview like this?

Salters: I think that’s what makes me different. This is right in my wheelhouse. The newsier the story, the more exciting it is for me. I hate that it’s a story like this, nobody is happy about it. . . . The background and training I had doing network news was invaluable. I think a lot of people could do hits, runs and errors. I mean covering O.J. Simpson everyday for two years — that trial was a fantastic learning experience. I covered the Timothy McVeigh trial and Terry Nichols, the Oklahoma City bombers. And I spent . . . seven years I as the late night reporter in Baltimore [at WBAL TV]. I was on the 11 p.m. news; there’s a lot of crime. So you’re interviewing people in difficult situations like yesterday . . . people whose relatives were just gunned down in the streets. The feedback I’ve gotten is that some people appreciated my tone in the interview. And to me that comes from doing a lot of sensitive interviews with people — that started in local television.

The Post: What was the most important take away from the interview for you?

Salters: I could see Kareem Hunt was extremely remorseful, but I think I felt more emotion from him when the cameras were off. I didn’t spend a lot of time with him before; I was at his home for maybe a good half-hour before we started, but intentionally just kind of stayed away from him because I wanted our conversation to be authentic. I just kind of said, “Hello, I’m here.” I said, “I’m going to have to ask you some tough questions,” and he said, “Okay.” And I went into another room. But I could see and hear more emotion from him in those two minutes than I saw during the interview. And when the interview was over we spent a couple minutes talking. I really could feel his remorse more then than I think it translated on camera.

I don’t know how much he helped himself or hurt himself yesterday, but I felt he was much more thoughtful when the cameras were off, which isn’t entirely unexpected. I have interviewed him before, he’s a quiet guy. Some guys just light up on camera; he’s not one of those guys. He’s shy, quiet, reserved. And I noted he was extremely uncomfortable and he was very nervous. That’s what people saw more of than a thoughtful, really sorrowful individual. And yet he was those things, which I could tell when the cameras were off.

The Post: Were you surprised by how little detail he went into about the events of the night of the video?

Salters: I was, because I told him beforehand — I said, “Look, I’m going to be asking you about what happened. Are you prepared to talk about what happened?” He said, “Yes, I am.” And then we get to that and he doesn’t. Afterward I asked his representatives and said, “Look, I was a little surprised. I think he could have helped himself if he had given us a little more information.” The concern was he didn’t want to look like he was making excuses or defending himself. Because he said, “I have absolutely no excuse.’ . . . So in his concern about not wanting to put up a defense he may have done himself a little bit of a disservice because he didn’t offer any explanation. He could have said, “This is what happened — X,Y,Z. This is what led to this out of character response.”

The Post: Are there any follow ups that you wish you could have asked?

Salters: I’m satisfied, but I wish I had asked if perhaps he had been drinking and if alcohol played a role.

The Post: It’s hard not to see this interview without considering ESPN’s Adam Schefter interview of Greg Hardy in 2016. [Hardy was a free agent then who had been accused of abusing his girlfriend, but the interview was criticized for lacking teeth.] Did that interview come up as something of a cautionary tale for how to handle this one?

Salters: I can tell you Greg Hardy’s name never came up. Everything happened quickly for me . . . If those discussions were happening internally back in Connecticut, I’m not sure, but that never came up for me.

[video][/video]
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The Post: Were you surprised by how little detail he went into about the events of the night of the video?

Salters: I was, because I told him beforehand — I said, “Look, I’m going to be asking you about what happened. Are you prepared to talk about what happened?” He said, “Yes, I am.” And then we get to that and he doesn’t. Afterward I asked his representatives and said, “Look, I was a little surprised. I think he could have helped himself if he had given us a little more information.” The concern was he didn’t want to look like he was making excuses or defending himself. Because he said, “I have absolutely no excuse.’ . . . So in his concern about not wanting to put up a defense he may have done himself a little bit of a disservice because he didn’t offer any explanation. He could have said, “This is what happened — X,Y,Z. This is what led to this out of character response.”
This is the part that worries me. Was he told by reps not to disclose much? If so, why? Was he not wanting to open up himself? If so, why. To me there are as many questions because of this interview than prior to the interview.

Remorse. Yea, most would be remorseful because they just lost their job, a job not many qualify for. He was getting paid pretty well with bigger paydays in his future. Hell yea he can be/act remorseful.

This interview does not do much for me. He may be smart as the only people who would not show remorse would be idiots.
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Otis Day wrote:
The Post: Were you surprised by how little detail he went into about the events of the night of the video?

Salters: I was, because I told him beforehand — I said, “Look, I’m going to be asking you about what happened. Are you prepared to talk about what happened?” He said, “Yes, I am.” And then we get to that and he doesn’t. Afterward I asked his representatives and said, “Look, I was a little surprised. I think he could have helped himself if he had given us a little more information.” The concern was he didn’t want to look like he was making excuses or defending himself. Because he said, “I have absolutely no excuse.’ . . . So in his concern about not wanting to put up a defense he may have done himself a little bit of a disservice because he didn’t offer any explanation. He could have said, “This is what happened — X,Y,Z. This is what led to this out of character response.”
This is the part that worries me. Was he told by reps not to disclose much? If so, why? Was he not wanting to open up himself? If so, why. To me there are as many questions because of this interview than prior to the interview.

Remorse. Yea, most would be remorseful because they just lost their job, a job not many qualify for. He was getting paid pretty well with bigger paydays in his future. Hell yea he can be/act remorseful.

This interview does not do much for me. He may be smart as the only people who would not show remorse would be idiots.
I can't get the video to load but you can watch the interview there.

Hearing Salters say that she could feel his emotion and remorse, even more so once the cameras were off, was important to me.
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I've come to the conclusion after seeing the video of a bump into the wall and a barely kickin the leg, and the knowledge that the woman was instigating with the N-word (basically begging him to hit her)… It just shouldn't be a career ending altercation.
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I will admit, I am jaded. I have heard hundreds of times the past 30 yrs, "I'm sorry", "I will never do it again", "I didn't mean to", "I will change", "I promise",....blah, blah, blah. It is hard for me to buy. There are 3 reported incidents. No arrests, but 3 separate reports. Are they true? We will probably never know. But I would err on the side of being cautious.

This team can win without a guy like this. RBs can be found. I don't want the Bears to put all their eggs in this guys basket no matter how fair the contract is to the Bears. They are no desperate. Me, as a fan, am not desperate. I can do without him.
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Otis Day wrote:I will admit, I am jaded. I have heard hundreds of times the past 30 yrs, "I'm sorry", "I will never do it again", "I didn't mean to", "I will change", "I promise",....blah, blah, blah. It is hard for me to buy. There are 3 reported incidents. No arrests, but 3 separate reports. Are they true? We will probably never know. But I would err on the side of being cautious.

This team can win without a guy like this. RBs can be found. I don't want the Bears to put all their eggs in this guys basket no matter how fair the contract is to the Bears. They are no desperate. Me, as a fan, am not desperate. I can do without him.
Here's what I could find:

JANUARY: Kansas City, Missouri
A man walked in to a Kansas City police station on January 11 to report that he was assaulted on January 7 at a nightclub by several people, including Hunt and his teammate George Atkinson, according to a police incident report.

JUNE: Put-in-Bay, Ohio
Hunt was still on the Chiefs' roster on June 3 when police in Put-in-Bay, Ohio, responded to what the department called a "minor altercation" at a local establishment.
"All involved parties declined to pursue charges. Put-in-Bay officers then cleared the scene with nothing further to report," the Put-in-Bay Police Department said in a statement without describing what happened.
"Shortly after this incident occurred, the NFL sent an official to pursue other facts from this incident."
Local media, citing police and a witness to the altercation, reported Hunt punched a man at the Bay Lodging Resort.
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Maybe I am jaded or just shallow. If he is cleared sign him. If he helps us win, sign him. If he doesnt mess up the locker room , sign him. Would I have said the same about Ray Rice? Nope. Totally different.

All the moral issues set aside, I will say, if signing him measn Howard is gone, that will seem bad at first, but Howard will be gone anyway. I personally think the reason Nagy hasnt run the ball when he should is because Howard just doesnt fit what Nagy wants to do. He can still be effective as we have seen, but maybe not Nagy Effective.

I dont know offhand what % of running plays to Hunt that Nagy called in those 5 games he called the plays but it would be interesting to see.
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I don't know, even though it was a decade ago, I still remember Tank Johnson and Cedric Benson, two guys who were given multiple second chances and threw them away. Can't help but think the same thing would happen with Kareem.
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This is the first time I have really dissected the videos. That I have watched and listened to what ACTUALLY went on. Watch these videos, and then you tell me who is at fault, and who is responsible. Listen to both of their explanations of the incident. That chick pushed multiple people trying to get to Hunt, and was hit, not by Hunt, but by someone being pushed into her. The kick at the end...that was minor at best.

I would sign Kareem tomorrow. That chick was trolling for a superstar. I'm sorry, I'm not into victim shaming, but I am also not into professional athletes getting targeted for their fame and money. Was everybody drinking, yeah probably. But that is their right as an over 21 year old in the US. Did he have the right to go out and party with his friends? Absolutely. Did she have the right to harass and provoke him? Absolutely not.

The incident

Two sides of the story

The Bears have a locker room that would help Hunt, not hurt him. With players like Mack, Hicks, Long and Robinson. They would be there as a positive force, not a negative one.

Sign that kid tomorrow.
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:This is the first time I have really dissected the videos. That I have watched and listened to what ACTUALLY went on. Watch these videos, and then you tell me who is at fault, and who is responsible. Listen to both of their explanations of the incident. That chick pushed multiple people trying to get to Hunt, and was hit, not by Hunt, but by someone being pushed into her. The kick at the end...that was minor at best.

I would sign Kareem tomorrow. That chick was trolling for a superstar. I'm sorry, I'm not into victim shaming, but I am also not into professional athletes getting targeted for their fame and money. Was everybody drinking, yeah probably. But that is their right as an over 21 year old in the US. Did he have the right to go out and party with his friends? Absolutely. Did she have the right to harass and provoke him? Absolutely not.

The incident

Two sides of the story

The Bears have a locker room that would help Hunt, not hurt him. With players like Mack, Hicks, Long and Robinson. They would be there as a positive force, not a negative one.

Sign that kid tomorrow.
Thank you! Meanwhile in Chiago I'm hearing the video is graphic and depicts him beating/brutalizing a woman. It's laughable.
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G08 wrote:
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:This is the first time I have really dissected the videos. That I have watched and listened to what ACTUALLY went on. Watch these videos, and then you tell me who is at fault, and who is responsible. Listen to both of their explanations of the incident. That chick pushed multiple people trying to get to Hunt, and was hit, not by Hunt, but by someone being pushed into her. The kick at the end...that was minor at best.

I would sign Kareem tomorrow. That chick was trolling for a superstar. I'm sorry, I'm not into victim shaming, but I am also not into professional athletes getting targeted for their fame and money. Was everybody drinking, yeah probably. But that is their right as an over 21 year old in the US. Did he have the right to go out and party with his friends? Absolutely. Did she have the right to harass and provoke him? Absolutely not.

The incident

Two sides of the story

The Bears have a locker room that would help Hunt, not hurt him. With players like Mack, Hicks, Long and Robinson. They would be there as a positive force, not a negative one.

Sign that kid tomorrow.
Thank you! Meanwhile in Chiago I'm hearing the video is graphic and depicts him beating/brutalizing a woman. It's laughable.
Brutalizing a woman?? Watch the incident video, and you tell me where he DIRECTLY brutalizes her? TWO times she pushed one of Kareem's friends, and then he pushes back, and indirectly knocks her down. He swiped his leg at her. He was free and clear. If he wanted to KICK her, he could have made a 43 yard FG (sorry) with her flailing body. Then in the subsequent interview video, she is desperately trying to get a hold of the hotel video.

Sorry, I'm not buying that he is a woman beater. I will believe that he lied to the Chiefs so he didn't get fired, but that is any employees problem trying to save their ass.

Sign Kareem tomorrow and don't look back. I will argue against anyone that says he is a woman beater. That is bullshit.

Ray Rice...completely different incident. Ray Rice cold cocked a woman. That's not what happened here.

Sign Kareem.
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I personally don't believe in ruining people's lives over small, in the grand scheme of offenses, like that. The league suspended him. Let everybody move on with their lives.

He should be allowed back in the league and whoever signs him is going to get a great player. I hope its the Bears.
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Question....

What about a looming suspension? I’ve heard rumors that he could actually be suspended for the entire 2019 season.
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EDIT/DELETED: I was thinking of Foster, not Hunt :)
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I do believe in people being able to redeem themselves, if they truly want to. I cannot condone violence to women or children at all. I do also think you have to look at the circumstances where someone becomes aggressive as every person on the world has a breaking point where they will gets aggressive as well.

Aggravating circumstances: Alcohol and group of young people together partying (we've all been young and partying with friends and know/remember how the energy and impulsiveness went up)
Actions: Hunt trying to make a guest leave
Guest becomes aggressive and tries to get to Hunt multiple times
Guest calls Hunt the N-word - cannot under estimate the pain this caused or minimize it
People pushed/bumped into Hunt by guest during confrontation and Hunt pushes people back off of himself causing guest to be knocked down
***Fuck-up Alert*** swipes leg towards fallen guest, for anyone whose seen kicks with intent to harm, that was more symbolic than savage, but either way was unacceptable

Clearly there is a major difference between this in scale and provocation than Ray Rice, McDonald, and a bunch of other men who were clearly intent on physically harming a woman.

Hunt should not be excused lightly, and I reiterate what I've said before. IF he is truly remorseful and committed to growth and change, he will not just do "anger management" but enter a program of therapy to unpack what brought him to a place where he has acted aggressively at least once confirmed time as a way of dealing with confrontation, possibly more pending investigation, as well as working towards more healthy ways of coping, thinking, and responding. IF he is willing and committed to that personal growth, than he is worth giving a chance to and signing him. If he is half-assed about it or less than committed, than no team should take the risk on him.

From a talent perspective, he would be a perfect fit for our offense and would elevate our play. I'm willing to extend the 2nd chance with our team IF he meets the above, if not...don't take the risk.
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cblaz11 wrote:Question....

What about a looming suspension? I’ve heard rumors that he could actually be suspended for the entire 2019 season.
I think that is a very slippery slope for the NFL. They're going to suspend a man for an entire season for something that was not pursued by police, and no citation or conviction on his record?

Doubt it.

6 games is what I expect.
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G08 wrote:
cblaz11 wrote:Question....

What about a looming suspension? I’ve heard rumors that he could actually be suspended for the entire 2019 season.
I think that is a very slippery slope for the NFL. They're going to suspend a man for an entire season for something that was not pursued by police, and no citation or conviction on his record?

Doubt it.

6 games is what I expect.
Does he get credit for time served?
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
G08 wrote:
cblaz11 wrote:Question....

What about a looming suspension? I’ve heard rumors that he could actually be suspended for the entire 2019 season.
I think that is a very slippery slope for the NFL. They're going to suspend a man for an entire season for something that was not pursued by police, and no citation or conviction on his record?

Doubt it.

6 games is what I expect.
Does he get credit for time served?
No idea but I am going to guess no.
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The Marshall Plan wrote:I personally don't believe in ruining people's lives over small, in the grand scheme of offenses, like that. The league suspended him. Let everybody move on with their lives.

He should be allowed back in the league and whoever signs him is going to get a great player. I hope its the Bears.
They actually didn’t suspend him yet. He’s on the commissioners exempt list. He still could be suspended for the incident. I suspect he will be, I doubt he gets “time served” for being released given the optics of the situation.
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Xee wrote:I don't know, even though it was a decade ago, I still remember Tank Johnson and Cedric Benson, two guys who were given multiple second chances and threw them away. Can't help but think the same thing would happen with Kareem.

The published stories and accounts of events certainly do not paint a very flattering picture of him. And I'm cynical enough to brush off promises of "learned my lesson", "won't happen again" responses from the player himself as simply saying what needs to be said in order to be able to again get a paycheck for playing a game.

If the Bears do sign him, it would need to be a contract that spells out what happens if he turns out to be a no account douche.
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Boris13c wrote:
Xee wrote:I don't know, even though it was a decade ago, I still remember Tank Johnson and Cedric Benson, two guys who were given multiple second chances and threw them away. Can't help but think the same thing would happen with Kareem.

The published stories and accounts of events certainly do not paint a very flattering picture of him. And I'm cynical enough to brush off promises of "learned my lesson", "won't happen again" responses from the player himself as simply saying what needs to be said in order to be able to again get a paycheck for playing a game.

If the Bears do sign him, it would need to be a contract that spells out what happens if he turns out to be a no account douche.
Didn't the white girl he pushed call him a "ni**er"??? Or was that just bogus?
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Richie wrote:
Boris13c wrote:
Xee wrote:I don't know, even though it was a decade ago, I still remember Tank Johnson and Cedric Benson, two guys who were given multiple second chances and threw them away. Can't help but think the same thing would happen with Kareem.

The published stories and accounts of events certainly do not paint a very flattering picture of him. And I'm cynical enough to brush off promises of "learned my lesson", "won't happen again" responses from the player himself as simply saying what needs to be said in order to be able to again get a paycheck for playing a game.

If the Bears do sign him, it would need to be a contract that spells out what happens if he turns out to be a no account douche.
Didn't the white girl he pushed call him a "ni**er"??? Or was that just bogus?
It's alleged, I don't think there is a recording of it or anything.

This is the shit that drives me crazy, everyone is all over this kid but nobody says a single thing about the girl's role in this and how she was the aggressor in a couple instances. It's so stupid.

I'd bet if every single male on this board was her height/weight/strength they wouldn't have gotten in Hunts face like this, slapped him, or chased after him after he left. Unless they were looking for a fight and/or ready to get their ass kicked.
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G08 wrote: ... This is the shit that drives me crazy, everyone is all over this kid but nobody says a single thing about the girl's role in this and how she was the aggressor in a couple instances. It's so stupid.

I'd bet if every single male on this board was her height/weight/strength they wouldn't have gotten in Hunts face like this, slapped him, or chased after him after he left. Unless they were looking for a fight and/or ready to get their ass kicked.
That's the sad thing about these young guys in sports.

You take a young person in their 20's, give them more money than most people will ever see in a lifetime and tell them to be responsible adults. In the meantime, every hanger-on, golddigger, bad actor in the world is glomming onto them with one hand open and the other carrying a cellphone/camera.

Then everyone sits back and tut-tuts about how irresponsible they are and what stupid decisions they make. Even though most people in that situation (myself included at 25 years old) would be totally unprepared for the kind of crap they have to deal with.

I hope Hunt is able to make it through to the other side of this.
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IotaNet wrote:
G08 wrote: ... This is the shit that drives me crazy, everyone is all over this kid but nobody says a single thing about the girl's role in this and how she was the aggressor in a couple instances. It's so stupid.

I'd bet if every single male on this board was her height/weight/strength they wouldn't have gotten in Hunts face like this, slapped him, or chased after him after he left. Unless they were looking for a fight and/or ready to get their ass kicked.
That's the sad thing about these young guys in sports.

You take a young person in their 20's, give them more money than most people will ever see in a lifetime and tell them to be responsible adults. In the meantime, every hanger-on, golddigger, bad actor in the world is glomming onto them with one hand open and the other carrying a cellphone/camera.

Then everyone sits back and tut-tuts about how irresponsible they are and what stupid decisions they make. Even though most people in that situation (myself included at 25 years old) would be totally unprepared for the kind of crap they have to deal with.

I hope Hunt is able to make it through to the other side of this.
G08 at 23 years old? Thank GOD they didn't have cellphone cameras back then :lol:

(no I wasn't going around accosting people -- I'm a lover, not a fighter)
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G08 wrote:
IotaNet wrote:
G08 wrote: ... This is the shit that drives me crazy, everyone is all over this kid but nobody says a single thing about the girl's role in this and how she was the aggressor in a couple instances. It's so stupid.

I'd bet if every single male on this board was her height/weight/strength they wouldn't have gotten in Hunts face like this, slapped him, or chased after him after he left. Unless they were looking for a fight and/or ready to get their ass kicked.
That's the sad thing about these young guys in sports.

You take a young person in their 20's, give them more money than most people will ever see in a lifetime and tell them to be responsible adults. In the meantime, every hanger-on, golddigger, bad actor in the world is glomming onto them with one hand open and the other carrying a cellphone/camera.

Then everyone sits back and tut-tuts about how irresponsible they are and what stupid decisions they make. Even though most people in that situation (myself included at 25 years old) would be totally unprepared for the kind of crap they have to deal with.

I hope Hunt is able to make it through to the other side of this.
G08 at 23 years old? Thank GOD they didn't have cellphone cameras back then :lol:

(no I wasn't going around accosting people -- I'm a lover, not a fighter)
Man I was. I was a hotheaded fighter in my 20's. I hung out with the wrong people and did all the wrong things.

Thank god there were no cellphones or social media... I know it would have absolutely burned me.
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