QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

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TheWorldBreaker
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:24 pm

BamaBear09 wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 11:09 am
If you watch Jake Fromm as a freshman, he looked like a future QB1... then followed that up with a sorta better sophomore season... then last year... multiple under 60% completion rate games with some under 50%... and this was also with a major drop in his average yard per pass... it was not pretty... people making excuses for him blame it on his surroundings... but it's Georgia... they restock with 5 stars just like Alabama and so to claim he didn't have talent around him is kinda bunk... just call a spade a spade, he plateaued as a prospect and regressed in his final year and went from a QB1 level player to someone who needs perfect surroundings to be good... and kinda already got one of those... I'm all for taking a flier on a later round QB and if Fromm is available in the 5th or 6th round, go for it... but he won't so let's grab Gordon from Wash St in the 5th/6th and go... he made some beautiful throws in the red zone during the senior bowl...
He might of regressed or the talent they re-loaded on wasn’t as good as they had hoped. I remember seeing a game in which Georgia’s Freshman WR got into a fight against a GT DB and so was ejected and suspended for at least the first half of a big SEC game the next week.

I only saw a handful of Georgia games this year but if that was indicative of the re-loading they did, it might not be all his fault.

Also, Georgia’s DC (Mel Tucker) became the CO head coach last year and I believe took a couple of lower level offensive assistants with him which might have had an impact.

There are a multitude of factors that could have led to his regression, so I wouldn’t be so dogmatic in analysis of him.

Especially, in light of him beating out two potential future first round picks.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:05 am

TheWorldBreaker wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:24 pm
BamaBear09 wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 11:09 am
If you watch Jake Fromm as a freshman, he looked like a future QB1... then followed that up with a sorta better sophomore season... then last year... multiple under 60% completion rate games with some under 50%... and this was also with a major drop in his average yard per pass... it was not pretty... people making excuses for him blame it on his surroundings... but it's Georgia... they restock with 5 stars just like Alabama and so to claim he didn't have talent around him is kinda bunk... just call a spade a spade, he plateaued as a prospect and regressed in his final year and went from a QB1 level player to someone who needs perfect surroundings to be good... and kinda already got one of those... I'm all for taking a flier on a later round QB and if Fromm is available in the 5th or 6th round, go for it... but he won't so let's grab Gordon from Wash St in the 5th/6th and go... he made some beautiful throws in the red zone during the senior bowl...
He might of regressed or the talent they re-loaded on wasn’t as good as they had hoped. I remember seeing a game in which Georgia’s Freshman WR got into a fight against a GT DB and so was ejected and suspended for at least the first half of a big SEC game the next week.

I only saw a handful of Georgia games this year but if that was indicative of the re-loading they did, it might not be all his fault.

Also, Georgia’s DC (Mel Tucker) became the CO head coach last year and I believe took a couple of lower level offensive assistants with him which might have had an impact.

There are a multitude of factors that could have led to his regression, so I wouldn’t be so dogmatic in analysis of him.

Especially, in light of him beating out two potential future first round picks.
Well, as people are already making excuses for his poor play, he doesn't seem like the type of QB I would be willing to use a high second round pick on... also the fact that he "beat out" two potential first round picks is more indicative of a coach making a decision based on who he trusted more at that moment over pure ability... so using that as a justification as to why he is a good QB is a bit silly... because I doubt he would have kept his job if either of the guys he got the nod over were still on the roster this past season during the guy's 5 straight games with under 50% completion rate...

Not interested in a QB that needs everything around him to be perfect in order to perform, as we already have one now... give me a guy who actually elevates those around him, doesn't need them to prop him up...
TheWorldBreaker
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:02 pm

BamaBear09 wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:05 am
TheWorldBreaker wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:24 pm


He might of regressed or the talent they re-loaded on wasn’t as good as they had hoped. I remember seeing a game in which Georgia’s Freshman WR got into a fight against a GT DB and so was ejected and suspended for at least the first half of a big SEC game the next week.

I only saw a handful of Georgia games this year but if that was indicative of the re-loading they did, it might not be all his fault.

Also, Georgia’s DC (Mel Tucker) became the CO head coach last year and I believe took a couple of lower level offensive assistants with him which might have had an impact.

There are a multitude of factors that could have led to his regression, so I wouldn’t be so dogmatic in analysis of him.

Especially, in light of him beating out two potential future first round picks.
Well, as people are already making excuses for his poor play, he doesn't seem like the type of QB I would be willing to use a high second round pick on... also the fact that he "beat out" two potential first round picks is more indicative of a coach making a decision based on who he trusted more at that moment over pure ability... so using that as a justification as to why he is a good QB is a bit silly... because I doubt he would have kept his job if either of the guys he got the nod over were still on the roster this past season during the guy's 5 straight games with under 50% completion rate...

Not interested in a QB that needs everything around him to be perfect in order to perform, as we already have one now... give me a guy who actually elevates those around him, doesn't need them to prop him up...
Why would a coach trust a less experienced QB more? It’s not a matter of coaches preference, he was demonstrably better than both.

He wasn’t as good last year which is why he’ll potentially be available when the Bears pick. There are a lot of potential explanations for why he wasn’t as good this year. Maybe he just got worse or maybe there were a confluence of factors that led to some poor play.

There are not going to be any slam duck picks for the Bears. So I don’t think you can just say his stats were down, he’s garbage. Pass. You can make a case against every potential QB the Bears will be in a position to draft. I don’t think you can afford to talk yourself out of every QB.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:21 am

TheWorldBreaker wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:02 pm

Why would a coach trust a less experienced QB more? It’s not a matter of coaches preference, he was demonstrably better than both.
Based on what? Your insider knowledge of how Justin Fields performed during Georgia's practices... Smart chose the QB he trusted at that moment and ended up losing the other two QBs to transfers because of those decisions... and again, if Fields hadn't transferred he would have taken Fromm's job this past season... but sure, he was demonstrably better, cause you said so...
He wasn’t as good last year which is why he’ll potentially be available when the Bears pick. There are a lot of potential explanations for why he wasn’t as good this year. Maybe he just got worse or maybe there were a confluence of factors that led to some poor play.

There are not going to be any slam duck picks for the Bears. So I don’t think you can just say his stats were down, he’s garbage. Pass. You can make a case against every potential QB the Bears will be in a position to draft. I don’t think you can afford to talk yourself out of every QB.
It was more than his stats... the best part of Fromm's game during his first two seasons was his accuracy and his decisions... both of which looked horrid this last season... and again making excuses for his play while in college is not what you want from a potential franchise QB...

1st round QBs are a 50/50 shot... and that number falls off a cliff after that... this draft has so much non-QB talent that first round talents will be available at 43 and 50, why waste a pick on a underwhelming QB over a TE or Edge player that can start season 1....
Drone7
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:33 am

Haven't seen Fromm other than some clips. Perhaps he was playing through an injury and toughed it out not admitting it?

Usually there is a physical reason for a drop-off in accuracy unless a QB is being asked to make longer more difficult throws.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:52 am

Not too many Georgia wide receivers and tight ends being noted for talent, unlike Alabama, which has become receiver central. Georgia remains a run first offense. It was No. 41 in the nation in passes traveling over 15 yards and they were No. 72 when it came to passes over 25 yards, LSU was No. 1 in both categories. Alabama was also in the top five in both categories. LSU and Alabama (and others) commonly employ spread formations, Georgia not so much.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:06 pm

The Marshall Plan wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 5:06 am
G08 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 11:22 pm
I think a lot of fans are going to be upset when we don't draft a QB until day 3 -- if at all.
Total agreement and I'll be one of them unless there's a notable veteran signed to be the backup. (Alex Smith, somebody like that.)

If the Pace & Nagy Regime has taught me anything its that there's a huge gap between what should be done and what they will do.
At this point I think that Pace understands that he has to win with Trubisky, because he won't be around to see if his next QB pick works out. He's all in on MItch, and will bring in a veteran as a mid-year back-up plan in case Trubisky completely shits the bed.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 04, 2020 3:27 pm

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:06 pm
The Marshall Plan wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 5:06 am


Total agreement and I'll be one of them unless there's a notable veteran signed to be the backup. (Alex Smith, somebody like that.)

If the Pace & Nagy Regime has taught me anything its that there's a huge gap between what should be done and what they will do.
At this point I think that Pace understands that he has to win with Trubisky, because he won't be around to see if his next QB pick works out. He's all in on MItch, and will bring in a veteran as a mid-year back-up plan in case Trubisky completely shits the bed.
I hope Pace is more proactive than that. At this point, he has to maximize their chances at QB. If the right guy is available in the 2nd round, he has to give it serious consideration.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:42 am

I don't think Fromm has the traits or ceiling of a first or second round talent. For me only Herbert is a 2nd round talent. I can see an argument, though, that Fromm is a cheaper and younger Chase Daniel 2.0 so the Bears should target him in the 3rd via trade, but I don't think he challenges as a starter... maybe ever.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:53 am

crueltyabc wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:42 am
For me only Herbert is a 2nd round talent.
What range did you rate Trubisky?
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:58 am

Drone7 wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:53 am
crueltyabc wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:42 am
For me only Herbert is a 2nd round talent.
What range did you rate Trubisky?
Does every thread have to be about Trubisky?
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:27 pm

I mean lots of us have been here for years, so there are receipts. Check out the actual threads from 2016-2017 and throw quotes in our faces if you want.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10525&p=154604&hili ... ky#p154604

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=11228&p=171033&hili ... ky#p171033

Apparently this was my first Mitch take, which is not bad:
I just watched three games on draftbreakdown and I really don't see why/how he's in the conversation for #3. He has nice touch on his passes but no power, and the decision making is suspect. Or rather... it's the decision making I'd expect from a high level QB playing his first season as a starter. He doesn't slide around well in the pocket and tended to get his olinemen in trouble when he avoided pressure by stepping into the path of a blocked player. His mechanics and size seem good? That's about all I liked.

My first take after he was drafted, also not bad:
The schedule plus lack of meaningful additions means we will be SO bad that Trubisky will play after this season is lost... which will be roughly the bye week.

As I recall, I was a Watson guy all the way. I think if Watson was gone at 3, I wanted Soloman Thomas (LOL) and Mahomes or Kizer (LOL) in the second? The threads exist if you wanna search. People did a good job with the headers so you can win with keyword and ascending date.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 1:35 pm

My question was not meant to rub anyone's face. I try to avoid that because what comes around...

I haven't watched the college crop because it looks like Pace is still bent on building around Trubisky. And I've heard Herbert has been erratic, so maybe that's why you consider him a second round value even though he seems certain to go in the top half of round 1? At least he earned more reps in college than Mitch. I had a real problem with that at the time, and I believe it was warranted in retrospect.

I watched some recent SB clips. I was more impressed with his physical talent than Trubisky's who went 2nd.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:38 pm

wab wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:58 am
Drone7 wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:53 am


What range did you rate Trubisky?
Does every thread have to be about Trubisky?
That, and about how much smarter than the rest of us he is.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:15 am

Just measured in at:

Height: 6-1 7/8
Weight: 219
Hand: 8 7/8 - this is troubling as 9" is the minimum threshold for QBs and NFL size footballs
Arm: 31 1/8
Wingspan: 75
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:51 am

BamaBear09 wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:15 am
Just measured in at:

Height: 6-1 7/8
Weight: 219
Hand: 8 7/8 - this is troubling as 9" is the minimum threshold for QBs and NFL size footballs
Arm: 31 1/8
Wingspan: 75
QB hand size. OL arm length. I'm sure there are other stats considered beneficial for a player at specific position. But Fromm didn't lose a fumble at Georgia, no miscues on the center snap, no bad handoffs to runners.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 10:56 am

Grizzled wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:51 am
BamaBear09 wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:15 am
Just measured in at:

Height: 6-1 7/8
Weight: 219
Hand: 8 7/8 - this is troubling as 9" is the minimum threshold for QBs and NFL size footballs
Arm: 31 1/8
Wingspan: 75
QB hand size. OL arm length. I'm sure there are other stats considered beneficial for a player at specific position. But Fromm didn't lose a fumble at Georgia, no miscues on the center snap, no bad handoffs to runners.
Well... no... he had 11 fumbles with 4 lost and had a run of 5 straight under 50% completion rate games... so now... 1. he couldn't elevate the talent around him... 2. he has questionable arm strength and 3. he could have issues with gripping the ball... how many more red flags do you guys need?
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:47 pm

I'm not a fan of taking a risky QB in Rd. 2. They are all going to have warts and we can't seem to develop QB's in Chicago for shit. I'd rather go the Dalton/Carr route and nab a developmental guy later.

I admit though that I'm intrigued by Jalen Hurts. Will start another thread on that as I am no draftnik and would like to hear from those more knowledgeable on him.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:10 pm

Passing charting on Fromm from a QB analyst I trust...

https://www.rotoworld.com/article/qb-kl ... jake-fromm
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:26 pm

dplank wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:47 pm
I'm not a fan of taking a risky QB in Rd. 2. They are all going to have warts and we can't seem to develop QB's in Chicago for shit. I'd rather go the Dalton/Carr route and nab a developmental guy later.

I admit though that I'm intrigued by Jalen Hurts. Will start another thread on that as I am no draftnik and would like to hear from those more knowledgeable on him.
That would be the preference. But bringing in Carr means Trubisky is finished in Chicago. Dalton could win the job if a QB competition is truly open. Either would give them the luxury of waiting till rounds 4 or 5 to find a developmental project.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:22 am

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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 10:22 am

BamaBear09 wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 10:56 am
Grizzled wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:51 am


QB hand size. OL arm length. I'm sure there are other stats considered beneficial for a player at specific position. But Fromm didn't lose a fumble at Georgia, no miscues on the center snap, no bad handoffs to runners.
Well... no... he had 11 fumbles with 4 lost and had a run of 5 straight under 50% completion rate games... so now... 1. he couldn't elevate the talent around him... 2. he has questionable arm strength and 3. he could have issues with gripping the ball... how many more red flags do you guys need?
This isn't to sound like a dick.

Give me your guy not a first rounder. You keep spewing the same statement. Name a QB you like. What you like. The elevate talent statement. I personally think it's dumb. John Elway laughs.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:03 am

I like Eason, but I think he's a bigger, less athletic version of Mitch when it comes to consistency. And he's got loads more experience. Like Mitch, he can amaze you with touch and accuracy...then just confuse the hell out of you by missing wide open guys high.

And I do like Fromm. He's pretty much a "what you see is what you get" kind of player. He's never going to wow you or be the reason you win games, but he has the ability to intelligently run an offense and do it consistently.

Out side of those two, I think Anthony Gordon, James Morgan, Bryce Perkins, and Steven Montez offer a lot of developmental upside but have significant warts.

Gordon was primarily a baseball player. His release is amazing...he gets the ball out as quickly as any QB as I've watched. Almost Aaron Rodgers like. His downside is that he doesn't have half the arm Rodgers does. Good leader, high football intelligence, mentally tough, and a hard worker. He's pretty much everything you look for in the makeup of a QB...except size and arm strength.

Morgan has a good arm, great anticipation, and nice pocket presence. He is able to go through his progressions when things are breaking down around him and deliver the ball on the money. But...he doesn't always go to the right place with the ball and takes some really really bad sacks. His footwork and ability to scan the field from the pocket are probably his best traits, but he's not a threat at all to run.

Perkins reminds me a little bit of Lamar Jackson, but not quite as explosive. He's got good accuracy and is a good rhythm thrower, but he's very much a one-read QB at this point like Jackson was coming out.

Montez is a big dude and an incredible athlete, but doesn't have much experience as a QB after mostly playing basketball. Looks to run more often than not but might have the best arm in the draft. I think he could climb into 2nd-3rd round consideration after workouts.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:15 am

To piggy-back on @wab 's response: I like both Morgan and Montez as draftable developmental guys, and Tyler Huntley and Cole McDonald as roll-of-the-dice, maybe-there's-something-there UDFAs.

My concern with Gordon is the lack of starting experience — already been down that road, you know?

Fromm's physical limitations suggest he's not going to develop into a high-level starter. He might prove me wrong (and I'll eat that crow if he does), but that's how I see him: a very good backup who doesn't have starter talent.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:24 am

thunderspirit wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:15 am
To piggy-back on @wab 's response: I like both Morgan and Montez as draftable developmental guys, and Tyler Huntley and Cole McDonald as roll-of-the-dice, maybe-there's-something-there UDFAs.

My concern with Gordon is the lack of starting experience — already been down that road, you know?

Fromm's physical limitations suggest he's not going to develop into a high-level starter. He might prove me wrong (and I'll eat that crow if he does), but that's how I see him: a very good backup who doesn't have starter talent.
Fromm is basically Chad Henne with a lesser arm.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:28 am

mmmc_35 wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 10:22 am
BamaBear09 wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 10:56 am


Well... no... he had 11 fumbles with 4 lost and had a run of 5 straight under 50% completion rate games... so now... 1. he couldn't elevate the talent around him... 2. he has questionable arm strength and 3. he could have issues with gripping the ball... how many more red flags do you guys need?
This isn't to sound like a dick.

Give me your guy not a first rounder. You keep spewing the same statement. Name a QB you like. What you like. The elevate talent statement. I personally think it's dumb. John Elway laughs.
Maybe go look at the Mahomes thread... that's a QB I liked... you can think it's dumb all you want... Fromm is a backup in the NFL... and if someone spends a 2nd round pick on him they are wasting a 2nd round pick...
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:56 pm

Fromm is a backup in the NFL... and if someone spends a 2nd round pick on him they are wasting a 2nd round pick...
But what if they need, you know, a backup?
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 1:03 pm

wab wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:56 pm
Fromm is a backup in the NFL... and if someone spends a 2nd round pick on him they are wasting a 2nd round pick...
But what if they need, you know, a backup?
Well then, I guess it would be a good pick as far as need... but the value would be on the low side...
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 1:16 pm

wab wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:24 am
Fromm is basically Chad Henne with a lesser arm.
This is a really good comp.
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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jake Fromm, Georgia

Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:32 pm

I was hoping to see Khalil Tate at the combine, but they didn't invite him. We may be able to pick him up as a developmental 3rd QB as a UFA. The guy is just athletic. WR speed at the QB position and a strong arm to boot. My nightmare is that Goon Bay gets him and I have to root against him for the next 10 years.
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