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Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:02 pm
by Bears Whiskey Nut
My brother-in-law just told me that Jalen Hurts could fall to the 2nd round due to injury. Mahomes part 2? Would we be bold enough to take a QB in the 2nd round?

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Patrick Mahomes II, Texas Tech

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:12 pm
by BR0D1E86
Hurts isn't a first round pick regardless. I like him as a developmental guy, but not until at least the second half of the second round.

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Patrick Mahomes II, Texas Tech

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:37 pm
by BamaBear09
I wouldn't take Hurts before the 4th round... he does not process quickly when it comes to going through progressions... he was handed the keys to the offense that had just produced back to back heisman winner/1st overall picks and did not perform at the same level... I love the kids mental toughness and leadership but physically he is a day three developmental QB... not sure how he would ever be thought of on the level of Mahomes as a prospect...

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:29 pm
by UOK
What people have said around the board about Hurts so far:

@UOK
Jalen Hurts: Gives me Trubisky vibes in terms of his feet and eyes. Not a great arm, but good accuracy. Would be considered slow at the NFL level.
@The Marshall Plan
I wanted a QB early for a lot reasons. No matter what we think of Mitch, at a minimum we need a backup QB with a higher ceiling than Daniel (with a much smaller cap hit) and at the same time we need the proverbial developmental QB.
In a perfect world we sign a veteran also to be the #2 and give Hurts a clipboard for a year. We then evaluate Mitch and see what we have. If Mitch shits the bed, Hurts could be the starter in 2021. Otherwise, our backup sees action every year, Hurts can prove himself then and either take the starting job or be trade bait like Jimmy G.
@IE
I really like Hurts. I like how mobile and aware he is, and do see him as similar to Trubisky in the right offense.... but more field awareness, honestly. He can run for 75 yards like Mitch, Lamar, Patrick or Russell. I see him as a leader & winner in a Watson-lite kind of way. I know he's not the same passer as a couple of those guys. But he's not a bad passer... probably as good as Mitch, but in different ways. I just want a winner, and I strongly believe that's a ton of value for a 2nd round pick.

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurt, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 3:23 pm
by Grizzled
Didn't impress in the post season all star games. I think he'll be around in the 4th or 5th. He has the heart and leadership. Accuracy and decision making were questioned.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 4:02 pm
by IE
I think he'll go day 2, and probably in the 2nd. I think a lot of teams are going to regret not taking him and the doubts about him are echos of Watson if you ask me.

I like the level he's played at. Bama is about as close to the NFL as you can get. He needed to go showcase himself at OK and he did - his production last fall was enormous, and if it wasn't for Burrow he could have a Heisman too. His intangibles dwarf many of these other potential QB picks.

Heck no he's not Mahomes. He's not the runner Jackson is but he definitely is as good as Mitch. I'd hope that he could be a Wilson "lite", or similar to Watson in terms of leadership and making plays with both his legs and arm. My bet would be that the pro game is already slower for him that it is for Mitch going into Year 4. That's what I meant by seeing the field - not necessarily progressions of a top passer at this point. But the calmness and natural confidence are key. You can't learn if you're panicking.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 6:27 pm
by EricTighe
He is a winner. But everyone has him dropping. Heard on the radio today some teams may ask him to switch positions. It doesn't mean he can't still play QB. Hell, some teams wanted to move Urlacher to Safety. Something happened at the Senior Bowl where he dropped and dropped bad. I doubt it was his play since they have seen the kid for 4 years. I even heard he could slip to round 6 to becoming an FA.

Feel bad for the kid cuz he seems like a great person. He is definitely a great teammate.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 9:06 pm
by TheWorldBreaker
Draft analysts were talking about him needing to change positions a year ago. The thought of him being a first rounder is largely just the product of ESPN hype, I think.

I don’t think he showed enough to go from a guy people thought needed to change positions to a relatively early draft pick.

That being said he has obviously improved and appears to be a hard worker, and is a good athlete, so I wouldn’t be heartbroken if they drafted him on day 3.

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurt, Oklahoma

Posted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:37 am
by Hoog
Grizzled wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 3:23 pm
Didn't impress in the post season all star games. I think he'll be around in the 4th or 5th. He has the heart and leadership. Accuracy and decision making were questioned.
I really like Hurt and Bryce Perkins in this draft. Yes, both have their deficiencies but I think both fit this offense very well and add a huge run dimension to the mix. Neither is terribly accurate or inaccurate and both have huge arms when needed. I don't think Trub's is going anywhere next year so neither will need to play next year and can get use to the offense. Might even be able to use them in a Tysome Hill way.

I agree with Grizzled above though. I wouldn't take either before the 4th unless we trade down in the second and pick up a late 3rd. Hurt didn't get a good write up at the Senior Bowl.

Jalen Hurts

Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:51 pm
by dplank
After seeing how Russell Wilson and Lamar Jackson and Deshaun Watson have lit up the NFL, it has me thinking about a guy like Jalen Hurts and if he could be the next one. All 3 of those guys got dinged for not having NFL accuracy/arm/pro system exp/etc and fell in the draft relative to their clear and obvious talent that we all now see.

So open question for those who watch lots of NCAA football, what are the chances that Hurts is another one of these guys? The few times I saw him play he looked like a gamer.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:55 pm
by UOK
Merging threads

Re: Jalen Hurts

Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:19 pm
by Grizzled
dplank wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:51 pm
After seeing how Russell Wilson and Lamar Jackson and Deshaun Watson have lit up the NFL, it has me thinking about a guy like Jalen Hurts and if he could be the next one. All 3 of those guys got dinged for not having NFL accuracy/arm/pro system exp/etc and fell in the draft relative to their clear and obvious talent that we all now see.

So open question for those who watch lots of NCAA football, what are the chances that Hurts is another one of these guys? The few times I saw him play he looked like a gamer.
2 teams running the KC offense have recently won a SB with more of a drop back passer rather than a Lamar Jackson type. Mahomes, admittedly, did scramble effectively this year at times. So is a pocket passer more of who the Bears should concentrate on?

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:25 pm
by wab
I like Perkins a little more than Hurts. I think Hurts is about as good as he's going to get.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:43 pm
by EricTighe
If Hurts is there in the 6th I would definitely take a flier. Your banking on greatness. Why not take a shot on a guy who does not let the pressure get to him. Let us see how he throws at the combine. Then we can further this narrative, I am definitely in his corner though.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:42 pm
by dplank
A lot of buzz about Hurts now, with a few mocks having us taking him in the 2nd. Honestly, I'd be thrilled. That guy looks like a gamer to me, I keep thinking Russell Wilson - who fell to the 3rd.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 5:52 pm
by Umbali
If we could trade back into the 3rd and get Hurts I would prefer that over a 2nd round pick. But to me he is worth a flier especially in this offense

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 6:32 pm
by Drone7
Most write-ups on Hurts say he drops his eyes when the first read is gone; that's not Russell Wilson

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:04 pm
by EricTighe
Thats not Russell WIlson but when he came out?

Russell Wilson, Quarterback, Seattle Seahawks
Wilson’s pre-draft process did not get off to a promising start. He landed on a list from The Sporting News of nine players who had the worst Senior Bowl performances. It predicted Wilson would go undrafted and sign somewhere as a free agent. Keep in mind this was only three months before the actual draft. The biggest issue was his height — he measured under 5-11 at the combine — and NFL.com said “it remains to be seen if he can throw effectively from the pocket at the next level.”

ProFootballWeekly's summary of Wilson as a prospect:

An instinctive, multisport athlete with a terrific work ethic and likable personality, Wilson has nearly everything you desire intangibly, including toughness, competitiveness and leadership. Never will be a prototypical dropback, pocket passer, as his height always will be a limiting factor, but he has the arm, legs and smarts to grow into an effective backup in a system where he can utilize play-action, rollouts, and improv skills to make plays. Versatile player who could even be sprinkled into the game plan on a weekly basis to take advantage of his dual-threat ability. Is the type of player you root for and want on your roster.

As far as measurables they are pretty close.
Russell Wilson - 71", 204 lbs, 10.25" Hands, 4.53 40-yard dash, 118" Broad, 34" Vert, 6.97 Three-cone, 28 Wonderlic

Other then Hurts being Taller and heavier.
Wilson has a 1/2" in hand size and is a blink of an eye faster.

At this point in their careers Jalen Hurts is very close to being Russell Wilson's twin in comparison.

This does not mean he will become Russell Wilson. But if Russell Wilson is what you are looking for in a QB this is about as close as it gets at this point in their careers.

Damn typing this up is making me wonder if we shouldn't take a stab in the second at greatness? He probably won't be ready right away but then again neither were a bunch of third and 4th round QB's who seem to be doing ok for themselves right now.

Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:12 pm
by Drone7
I seldom watch college football.

So I didn't watch Wilson until he reached the pros. When drafted, I was surprised a guy that tall was picked that high by Seattle.

Then I watched him play as a rookie. And I immediately understood why. Situational smarts, great athletic ability and obvious poise.

Anyone could see he had IT (unlike Trubisky)

Wilson is also one of the best improvisational players and deep passers in the league, which isn't something a QB can develop much--those traits are natural gifts.

Wilson will be a HOFer.

So those are big shoes for Hurts to fill. It's not enough to be athletic. It's the mental traits that separate Wilson.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:23 pm
by dplank
Guys like Wilson, or Dak...not that easy to see who they were going to be in the pro's. If it was they would have been drafted higher, obviously. Hurts has the field generalship and high level success, coupled with outstanding physical traits, and high character, that make him analogous to a Wilson or Watson or Jackson coming out. He could flop, but I have a gut feeling he's going to be really good. I'd love to get him.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:53 am
by Grizzled
The Parcells criteria for drafting a QB applied to Hurts. Just another tool for assessment, doesn't address the soft issues such as leadership, etc.

Three years as a starter? Yes
Is he a senior? Yes
Did he graduate? Yes
Did he start 30 games? Yes, 42 games
Did he win 23 games? Yes, 38 games
TD-INT ratio at least 2-1? Yes, 80-20
Completion percentage over 60? Yes, 65.1 percent

7/7 criteria met

Justin Herbert also met all 7 of the criteria, Burrow 5, Tua 2, Fromm 5, Eason 1.

For 2019, none of the top QBs (Murray, Lock, Haskins, Jones) met the criteria. Murray and Jones had pretty good seasons, Lock was coming on, Haskins played a limited amount.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:53 pm
by crueltyabc
Basically since mid-season last year I've been saying 2020 is a lost season while the Bears recover from the Mitch pick and a couple of FA signings that didn't work out. I've been lukewarm on the Derek Carr idea that has others excited.

Now suddenly I'm caught in the Hurts hype

Trubisky
Mariota
Hurts

They can run the same offense for all three guys, and Hurts can have half a season to learn while the other guys flounder. You can already see improvement in Hurts' throwing motion based on his offseason work. To me, that shows that he's coachable. Per Mooch's chalkboard session you see that he's intelligent, confident, and articulate. I'm sold. Let's get him at 42 if we can.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:59 pm
by wab
The problem is, I don't think Hurts makes it past the Chargers in R2 if they take an OT in R1.

I've been holding off on a mock draft until I see how FA shakes out, because there's a good-to-decent FA QB out there for every team that needs a QB.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:02 pm
by IE
Watching 10 struggle with field awareness, presence, calm and control in this past season drew me to Hurts like a bug to a bonfire. Hurts is just a man out there... he's just dripping with intangibles that were completely missing from the Bears. It's right there for everyone to see. But people are still missing it.

Why? Look no further than the "change positions" nonsense. Holy crap that's some serious last-century racially tinged bullshit right there. But that's the kind of persistent bias horsecrap that is likely to have him fall right into the Bear's lap - and Pace better not fuck it up if it does.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 7:47 am
by EricTighe
You do realize this has nothing to do with Racism. Back in the day black QB's were athletic but not smart enough. No one is questioning his intellect. In fact they are questioning his ability to pick up 2nd and 3rd reads, his accuracy and it has been brought up in every source about how he was replaced by a true freshman QB while at Alabama in the championship game. A game he was losing by the way.

After us getting Nick Foles I am really hoping we pick up Hurts in the draft now. Hell I am praying we get him. He is the classic boom-you know what you got case. At worst he is a career back-up that will win games for teams. At best he is your franchise QB. WHo will do nothing to hurt the team.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:01 am
by Mikefive
Drone7 wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 6:32 pm
Most write-ups on Hurts say he drops his eyes when the first read is gone; that's not Russell Wilson
Bingo.

Watched tape on this guy yesterday. I can see the Lamar Jackson-esque appeal. But I really don't like this guy. Maybe in R5. But I'm biased. I don't like guys with this kind of game, because they have serious limitations and if you can box them in the pocket so they can't run around, they're quite beatable. In order to be successful, he MUST have Lamar Jackson escapability skill. Otherwise, he could be a huge bust. These guys are likely to have short careers.

You see the same thing over and over on tape 90% of the time. Drops back. Looks at first read, often really short throw. It's often not there. He drops eyes and looks for escape route, which is often a designed clear out by WR vacating one side of the field. if he escapes horizontally, he'll take a look downfield for an improvisation throw opportunity. Otherwise, he just runs. That and a lot of RRO's.

Really good athlete. Throws a lot of short stuff. Not particularly accurate. Doesn't even attempt read progressions. Constantly looking to run.

They should come up with another name for guys who play like LJ and Hurts, because they're completely different than more traditional quarterbacks and you have to design an offense particularly for them. Scrambleback? Scamperback? Improviback? Athleteback? I'm going with Scatterback, because it's easier to say.

Anybody got a bettter name for these guys?

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:41 am
by RichH55
IE wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 4:02 pm


I like the level he's played at. Bama is about as close to the NFL as you can get.

He lost the job there in fairness - and I always thought that playing for a powerhouse was a duel edged sword for a QB

Playing with better talent at most positions than the opponent - Playmakers all over

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:42 pm
by Yogi da Bear
I was amazed by Russell Wilson's accuracy in the Rose Bowl against my Ducks.



Haven't seen that kind of accuracy from Hurts. Don't seem like the same type of players to me. Not saying that Hurts won't be successful. Just that Wilson isn't a good comp for him. Lamar Jackson is a much better comp.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:13 am
by The Cooler King
I would like Hurts, but also recognize you may have to cater your O around him. Higher risk/reward, but I'd be okay in the second.

With talk about a guy like Fromm dropping, he may reach a point where he is good value, despite not being super toolsy. Of sourse that would be a trade down or trade up scenario and there's no crystal ball where you can be sure he'd be there.

Hurst or Eason mid to late 2nd
Fromm late 3rd to mid 4th
Gordon mid 4th to mid 5th
Morgan/McDonald 6th or later
That's probably my rough QB board. Hope they get 1.

Re: Re: QB Prospect Discussion: Jalen Hurts, Oklahoma

Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:09 am
by wab
Well there's now talk that Hurts could sneak into the very bottom of R1.

I can't say I see that happening, but weirder things have happened.