Calling all cap wizards
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- southdakbearfan
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I know some of the details aren’t out but as soon as it’s available could we get an update on cap status from you cap wizards
- The Cooler King
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@BradOTC on Twitter is a decent resource for now. But yea, need more details. Though as soon as I could have them, OTC or spotrac will have them too.
- southdakbearfan
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I always seem to find inconsistencies between the two.The Cooler King wrote: ↑Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:44 pm @BradOTC on Twitter is a decent resource for now. But yea, need more details. Though as soon as I could have them, OTC or spotrac will have them too.
- Moriarty
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Right now Spotrac lists the Bears as WAY over the cap.
Unless there is/was a major restructure with Foles not reflected there, about the only reasonable way to get back under would be to trade Mitch and his 9.2M
Unless there is/was a major restructure with Foles not reflected there, about the only reasonable way to get back under would be to trade Mitch and his 9.2M
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- dplank
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I thought I read somewhere about Kyle Long's money not coming off the books yet for some reason...but would (at some point, don't know when or understand why it hasn't already happened)
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Cody Whitehair restructured. They'll need more space to add veteran oline and DBs.
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Hicks and Robinson are the other big contracts to consider. Hicks should be excited to have Quinn so he'll go along with it but ARob.... I guess we're gonna find out what he thinks about the future of QBs in Chicago.
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- southdakbearfan
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I do think Longs money is still showing on some.
OTC shows us at 7 million plus but I don’t see graham on there. Foles and Quinn are.
Spotrac shows -5 million plus, no graham.
Major differences between the two in how much hit Quinn is. One says 6.1 mill. The other 16.1 million.
OTC shows us at 7 million plus but I don’t see graham on there. Foles and Quinn are.
Spotrac shows -5 million plus, no graham.
Major differences between the two in how much hit Quinn is. One says 6.1 mill. The other 16.1 million.
- Moriarty
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That's the difference between 12.5 roster bonus vs 12.5 signing bonus.southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:57 am Major differences between the two in how much hit Quinn is. One says 6.1 mill. The other 16.1 million.
Seems like signing would be more to what the Bears need right now (which would mean less now, but also no dead money after 2yrs wouldn't be true).
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- southdakbearfan
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Kind of what I thought But it shows as a roster bonus on both sites. I am sure they will have it sooner or later.Moriarty wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:12 amThat's the difference between 12.5 roster bonus vs 12.5 signing bonus.southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:57 am Major differences between the two in how much hit Quinn is. One says 6.1 mill. The other 16.1 million.
Seems like signing would be more to what the Bears need right now (which would mean less now, but also no dead money after 2yrs wouldn't be true).
- The Cooler King
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Yea - seems like there is some confusion as to the type of bonus he has. BradOTC had a tweet chain that touched on it... I'm sure it will get cleared up soon enough. I doubt anything is even format at this point, so it may just take a day or two.southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:17 amKind of what I thought But it shows as a roster bonus on both sites. I am sure they will have it sooner or later.
- Yogi da Bear
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Sportstrac is wrong. It's a roster bonus that the Bears are treating like a signing bonus. Don't know why they'd do that, but that's how it's been explained.
- The Cooler King
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So after looking at Spotrac and Over the Cap, looks like their difference is basically the Robert Quinn question. 6.1M v 16.1M cap hit. Also, spotrac doesn't have the Whitehair restructure, that's about the total difference.
It just doesn't seem logical that the Bears would/could structure Quinn as the latter, so I'd go with OTC's numbers (I did take a stab at reading through the CBA, and its not totally clear to me which of the criteria Quinn's bonus meets to be considered a signing bonus/pro-rated. But there's 15 possible criteria and many are confusing and convoluted to read). They still don't show Bush, but they're showing 7.4 in space. Less (1.4), and the Bears are at 6.0. The rookie cap number should be right around 5. Now that's only for the "top 51" number for offseason calculations, so you're over the cap just by adding your 52-53 man on minimum rookie deals.
So they effectively have zero usable cap room at the moment.
Cap Clearing possibilities;
Allen Robinson;
Current Cap hit is $15M with $4M in dead cap.
Extend him at something like $15M signing bonus + additional $10M in guaranteed salaries on a 3 year extension and a low Y1 base salary (Cooper just got $40M guaranteed over 5 years as reference)
Estimated 2020 cap hit = 8.75 = up to 6.25M savings
Akiem Hicks;
With a base salary of 10.2, a restructure can probably clear about $4M conservatively.
Mitchell Trubisky;
In a trade, you'd save about $4.4M. But he'd be probably be about $3M to replace for a new backup, so factoring in replacement cotst, net $1.4M
Adam Shaheen;
I don't think they'll rush to cut him before training camp, but he'll save $1.2M to release
Ben Braunecker;
He'll be on the roster bubble. If they do eventually release him thats ~$1.5M saving.
So 6.25+4+1.4+1.2+1.5 = 14.35 max they can still clear. But probably figure $5M just for in-season cushion of additonal dead cap hits and salaries past your 53rd man.
Major holes
RG (Coward is current starter)
CB (Roberson/Toliver/Shelley current possible starters)
SS (Bush current starter)
LS (its been reported Scales signed, but he's not listed on OTC yet)
OL Depth (really no backups with actual playing experience)
OLB depth (Vaughters only backup)
RB, WR, DL, ILB could all use varying degrees of depth.
You have 7 picks to help fill those holes, but only 2 before pick 163. So I'd say you probably are easily spending that $10M just on rounding out the roster on near-minimum FA.
Possibly areas that could change these;
further clarification on the Quinn structure
new details about Foles restructure that go against current reports
It just doesn't seem logical that the Bears would/could structure Quinn as the latter, so I'd go with OTC's numbers (I did take a stab at reading through the CBA, and its not totally clear to me which of the criteria Quinn's bonus meets to be considered a signing bonus/pro-rated. But there's 15 possible criteria and many are confusing and convoluted to read). They still don't show Bush, but they're showing 7.4 in space. Less (1.4), and the Bears are at 6.0. The rookie cap number should be right around 5. Now that's only for the "top 51" number for offseason calculations, so you're over the cap just by adding your 52-53 man on minimum rookie deals.
So they effectively have zero usable cap room at the moment.
Cap Clearing possibilities;
Allen Robinson;
Current Cap hit is $15M with $4M in dead cap.
Extend him at something like $15M signing bonus + additional $10M in guaranteed salaries on a 3 year extension and a low Y1 base salary (Cooper just got $40M guaranteed over 5 years as reference)
Estimated 2020 cap hit = 8.75 = up to 6.25M savings
Akiem Hicks;
With a base salary of 10.2, a restructure can probably clear about $4M conservatively.
Mitchell Trubisky;
In a trade, you'd save about $4.4M. But he'd be probably be about $3M to replace for a new backup, so factoring in replacement cotst, net $1.4M
Adam Shaheen;
I don't think they'll rush to cut him before training camp, but he'll save $1.2M to release
Ben Braunecker;
He'll be on the roster bubble. If they do eventually release him thats ~$1.5M saving.
So 6.25+4+1.4+1.2+1.5 = 14.35 max they can still clear. But probably figure $5M just for in-season cushion of additonal dead cap hits and salaries past your 53rd man.
Major holes
RG (Coward is current starter)
CB (Roberson/Toliver/Shelley current possible starters)
SS (Bush current starter)
LS (its been reported Scales signed, but he's not listed on OTC yet)
OL Depth (really no backups with actual playing experience)
OLB depth (Vaughters only backup)
RB, WR, DL, ILB could all use varying degrees of depth.
You have 7 picks to help fill those holes, but only 2 before pick 163. So I'd say you probably are easily spending that $10M just on rounding out the roster on near-minimum FA.
Possibly areas that could change these;
further clarification on the Quinn structure
new details about Foles restructure that go against current reports
- dplank
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I don't see the point keeping Braunecker at 1.6M and Shaheen at 1.2M. They should pick the one they like best and dump the other one now IMO, and let Holtz/Horsted, or even a draft pick, be the 4th.
- The Cooler King
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Eh there's just such little payoff to do it at this point. You ride through the offseason program and training camp cuz you never know what injuries will bring and such.
Just antsy fans wanting to get the satisfaction of seeing Shaheen get the boot.
- dplank
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No, just an antsy fan wanting a viable RG.The Cooler King wrote: ↑Fri Mar 20, 2020 2:27 pmEh there's just such little payoff to do it at this point. You ride through the offseason program and training camp cuz you never know what injuries will bring and such.
Just antsy fans wanting to get the satisfaction of seeing Shaheen get the boot.
- Yogi da Bear
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We're going to find a viable OG in the draft. There are a ton of them. Hell, with Onwenu, you could get an experienced starting RG in the fifth or sixth. If they don't address OG in free agency, I expect two in the draft.
- The Cooler King
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Totally unrelated.dplank wrote: ↑Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:07 pmNo, just an antsy fan wanting a viable RG.The Cooler King wrote: ↑Fri Mar 20, 2020 2:27 pm
Eh there's just such little payoff to do it at this point. You ride through the offseason program and training camp cuz you never know what injuries will bring and such.
Just antsy fans wanting to get the satisfaction of seeing Shaheen get the boot.
- Moriarty
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This is a rough guesstimate of how things could shape up.
It puts them about 4M over, after adding in 5.2M on draft picks and 4.5M on minor FA additions.
Restructuring a little (Robinson?) would be absolutely necessary.
Graham's contract isn't really known.
Jags may have eaten some of Foles' money in a restructure (I hope - if they didn't Pace was horrifyingly pantsed in the deal).
It puts them about 4M over, after adding in 5.2M on draft picks and 4.5M on minor FA additions.
Restructuring a little (Robinson?) would be absolutely necessary.
Graham's contract isn't really known.
Jags may have eaten some of Foles' money in a restructure (I hope - if they didn't Pace was horrifyingly pantsed in the deal).
Code: Select all
PLAYER POS. AGE EXPIRES 2020 CAP FIGURE
Kyle Fuller CB 28 2022 $11,500,000
Buster Skrine CB 31 2022 $6,100,000
Kevin Toliver CB 24 2021 $755,000
draft draft
Duke Shelley CB 23 2023 $706,960
Akiem Hicks DL 30 2022 $11,800,000
Eddie Goldman DL 26 2023 $10,800,000
Roy Robertson-Harris DL 27 2021 $3,259,000
Urban FA $1,000,000
Bilal Nichols DL 23 2022 $824,870
Abdullah Anderson DL 24 2021 $675,000
Roquan Smith ILB 23 2023 $5,129,227
Danny Trevathan ILB 30 2023 $4,168,750
Joel Iyiegbuniwe ILB 24 2022 $919,643
Devante Bond ILB 27 2021 $825,000
draft ILB draft
Eddy Piniero K 24 2021 $750,000
LS FA $1,000,000
Charles Leno OL 28 2022 $10,294,000
Bobby Massie OL 31 2023 $8,300,000
Cody Whitehair OL 28 2025 $4,200,000
James Daniels OL 22 2022 $1,895,498
draft draft
Corey Levin OL 26 2021 $834,000
Rashaad Coward OL 25 2021 $825,000
Alex Bars OL 24 2021 $675,000
Khalil Mack OLB 29 2025 $26,600,000
Robert Quinn OLB 30 2025 $6,100,000
Lynch FA $1,500,000
James Vaughters OLB 27 2021 $675,000
Pat O'Donnell P 29 2021 $1,850,000
Nick Foles QB 31 2023 $15,625,000
Mitchell Trubisky QB 26 2022 $9,327,591
Tarik Cohen RB 25 2021 $2,291,916
David Montgomery RB 23 2023 $945,681
draft draft
Eddie Jackson S 27 2025 $3,716,450
Deon Bush S 27 2021 $1,400,000
draft draft
Kentrell Brice S 26 2021 $825,000
Stephen Denmark S 24 2021 $610,000
Trey Burton TE 28 2022 $8,550,000
Jimmy Graham TE 33 2022 $7,000,000
Holtz FA $1,000,000
Demetrius Harris TE 29 2021 $1,650,000
Ben Braunecker TE 26 2021 $1,618,750
Eric Saubert TE 26 2021 $829,000
Jesper Horsted TE 23 2021 $675,000
Allen Robinson WR 27 2021 $15,000,000
Cordarrelle Patterson WR 29 2021 $5,750,000
Anthony Miller WR 25 2022 $1,460,100
Riley Ridley WR 24 2023 $845,649
Javon Wims WR 25 2022 $773,978
salaries $203,856,063
dead cap $7,600,000
est draft $5,200,000
total $216,656,063
adj cap $212,500,000
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- southdakbearfan
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Current Status - OTC - 8.12 million under - doesn't show Graham, Quinns deal has the 12.5 bonus prorated out.
SpotRac - 7.5 under = Quinns deal has 12.5 prorated out, does not show Graham deal.
So it would appear the 12.5 bonus portion is prorated out on Quinn.
SpotRac - 7.5 under = Quinns deal has 12.5 prorated out, does not show Graham deal.
So it would appear the 12.5 bonus portion is prorated out on Quinn.
- dplank
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Do you guys know if they are including a dollar figure for Coward and Holtz since they show them as on the roster? If so is it some expected number based on their RFA status? This cap shit confuses me.
Can someone just sum it up here? Do we have money to sign a Tony Jefferson type guy, or a stop gap RG?
Can someone just sum it up here? Do we have money to sign a Tony Jefferson type guy, or a stop gap RG?
- Moriarty
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What I posted has Coward included (per Spotrac).dplank wrote: ↑Sun Mar 22, 2020 8:23 am Do you guys know if they are including a dollar figure for Coward and Holtz since they show them as on the roster? If so is it some expected number based on their RFA status? This cap shit confuses me.
Can someone just sum it up here? Do we have money to sign a Tony Jefferson type guy, or a stop gap RG?
Holtz has a figure, but I put FA on that line, meaning I'm suggesting that as a FA move. Spotrac has him as unsigned currently.
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