State of the OL Competitions

[dplank]

Huh? How so?

Jones is a guy from a small school who didn't always play the best competition...and he may not even have always had the best coaching, either. The staff undoubtedly has a bunch of things they want Jones to work on so as to improve his game, give him a chance to be an important piece, or even make the team. Maybe Jones is simply learning quickly? Not unheard of at all. And the sign of a good player, btw.

To be uber clear, all I'm saying is it's too early to read anything into any position swapping / depth chart movement right now. These guys have practiced like 8 times, in shorts and without pads. You don't get much of a view of OL in this environment. There is simply no way for any player - OL in particular - to show coaches much of anything yet. Maybe a little bit, but no way enough to justify shuffling the depth chart around. A handful of no pad practices just doesn't give you what you need to know yet. It's far more likely that Flus is shuffling guys around and tinkering, and he's probably doing some Bilichick type motivation stuff as well with guys like JJ and Jenkins - guys he sees as crucial pieces to the upcoming season and wants to be "on edge and fired up". It sounded to me like you were projecting that after a handful of practices that the coaches now believe Jones can win the job, and that's a "new thought" after these practices that they didn't have before these practices - if that wasn't your intent then I read it wrong and disregard.

In no way am I saying Jones can't ultimately do what you are suggesting, it's just not possible after a handful of minicamp practices w/o pads. Jones may very well win the job over Borom, it wouldn't shock me at all. It would shock me, and disappoint me greatly, if Jenkins isn't a starter Week 1.

We just saw this with JJ, who we all know will start Week 1 barring injury, so I'm not worried about Jenkins yet. But the counter seems to be that Flus worded things differently in his presser, so we're to believe it's some revelation about Jones but a nothingburger with JJ? Parsing presser words, particularly this time of year, isn't a great idea IMO.

[Heinz D.]

Hopefully Eberflus will reward players who perform with more playing time not slash it to a bare minimum. What a novel concept that would be in Chicago.

In no way am I saying Jones can't ultimately do what you are suggesting, it's just not possible after a handful of minicamp practices w/o pads. Jones may very well win the job over Borom, it wouldn't shock me at all. It would shock me, and disappoint me greatly, if Jenkins isn't a starter Week 1.

What I bolded first--I'd be stunned, too. Jenkins' tape from college is really impressive.

As to the rest, yeah it's too early too make specific judgements, but guessing they're pleased with Jones' progress is not too far out there...

We just saw this with JJ, who we all know will start Week 1 barring injury, so I'm not worried about Jenkins yet. But the counter seems to be that Flus worded things differently in his presser, so we're to believe it's some revelation about Jones but a nothingburger with JJ? Parsing presser words, particularly this time of year, isn't a great idea IMO.

True enough.

As to what the deal is with Johnson...well, he got in the doghouse early, and let's not forget that he didn't play all that well at the beginning of last year, and if we're being honest, didn't show the consistency down the stretch that you want from a starter. And I don't dislike Johnson at all, and he'll almost certainly start--but he may not be the finished product that he may think he is.

[Bearfacts]

I'd agree with this if you took the word "now" out, which implies they've seen something already that's changed their mind in some way. That, is absolute poppycock IMO. I do think heading into camp that every position on the OL, and most elsewhere on the team except maybe QB, is a competition and the best player will play. Poles/Flus have no allegiance to anyone on the current roster and are free to evaluate with fresh eyes and no prior baggage. So I'm sure Jones has a shot as does everyone else, I believe that this was the course that was set Day 1 on Poles/Flus watch. I don't read anything into any of this stuff going on right now, this is the time to tinker around with things. Once camp hits, you should have an idea and have guys playing in their positions to create cohesiveness. At that point, if you aren't first string you'll need to beat the man in front of you - which I believe nearly everyone on the roster will have an opportunity to do. If there's a promotion / demotion during full camp in August, I'll pay attention at that point.

This is where I am with it as well.

It would make far more sense to get some serious evaluations done during OTA and use camp to perfect the blocking scheme with the 5 guys they plan to start. That still doesn't preclude competition among the OL but the pecking order will have been established by then and whoever the #2 guy is he'll need to outplay the #1 in camp in order to take his job away.

No more musical chairs with the OL or at least very little of it throughout camp and the preseason. The #2 and #3 will get plenty of reps during preseason games.

[The Marshall Plan]

Today's depth chart means absolutely nothing. The depth chart is just an organizational tool, at this point, that means who gets the playing time with who. If it's the first team they're evaluating a guy who they think is good and in order to do that he has to be on the first team and then to also play against the first team defense.

[Atkins&Rebel]

These guys have practiced like 8 times, in shorts and without pads. You don't get much of a view of OL in this environment. There is simply no way for any player - OL in particular - to show coaches much of anything yet. Maybe a little bit, but no way enough to justify shuffling the depth chart around. A handful of no pad practices just doesn't give you what you need to know yet. It's far more likely that Flus is shuffling guys around and tinkering, and he's probably doing some Bilichick type motivation stuff as well with guys like JJ and Jenkins - guys he sees as crucial pieces to the upcoming season and wants to be "on edge and fired up". It sounded to me like you were projecting that after a handful of practices that the coaches now believe Jones can win the job, and that's a "new thought" after these practices that they didn't have before these practices - if that wasn't your intent then I read it wrong and disregard.

In no way am I saying Jones can't ultimately do what you are suggesting, it's just not possible after a handful of minicamp practices w/o pads. Jones may very well win the job over Borom, it wouldn't shock me at all. It would shock me, and disappoint me greatly, if Jenkins isn't a starter Week 1.

We just saw this with JJ, who we all know will start Week 1 barring injury, so I'm not worried about Jenkins yet. But the counter seems to be that Flus worded things differently in his presser, so we're to believe it's some revelation about Jones but a nothingburger with JJ? Parsing presser words, particularly this time of year, isn't a great idea IMO.

In regards to not being able to tell much about the O line in unpadded practices, here are a few things that can stick out on the mental side:
-Knowing the playbook assignments for each play
-Knowing what the guy's assignment next to you for every play
-Knowing the blocking based on audibles at the line
-Showing hustle on every play
-Being able to go one the correct snap count
-Guys individually talking about how best to combo block certain guys on specific plays

Then you also have how they're moving and what they are doing in the weight room after practice and their health in general.
Just because you see it's an unpadded practice, doesn't mean coaches aren't getting some huge insights in O line abilities.
Granted, once these guys throw on the pads and have to physically move the guys across from them it's a different story. But the ground work and how much the coaches can trust the guys starts right now.

[dplank]

Sure all true, but do you really think that JJ’s one day demotion is in any way at all an indicator of his starter status? I don’t. So yea, they learn about guys every day even when off the field and in meeting rooms. But I still put no significance at all in JJ’s demotion. Like, none. And so I don’t read anything into Jenkins or Borom or Jones yet either. There are just too many reasons why he might be juggling guys around to worry about it. When camp starts, we will know.

[Kylo Bearen]

I'm hoping we see this version of Jenkins.

[Atkins&Rebel]

Sure all true, but do you really think that JJ’s one day demotion is in any way at all an indicator of his starter status? I don’t. So yea, they learn about guys every day even when off the field and in meeting rooms. But I still put no significance at all in JJ’s demotion. Like, none. And so I don’t read anything into Jenkins or Borom or Jones yet either. There are just too many reasons why he might be juggling guys around to worry about it. When camp starts, we will know.

I think early "demotions" send a message to get to where the team thinks you need to be in terms of mental preparation, physical hustle, and/or physical readiness.
I also think if JJ doesn't start at RT, he's our RG barring injury.
But if the Bears don't trust JJ's back, this is an early indication of that and it looks like they'd want the rookie at LT and slide Borom to RT if JJ does go down.

[dplank]

Athletic piece on it today, they seem to think it does say something about Jenkins specifically. I disagree and think it’s sending a message like you say, will see when camp opens.

[UOK]

Athletic piece on it today, they seem to think it does say something about Jenkins specifically. I disagree and think it’s sending a message like you say, will see when camp opens.

The Athletic basically implied it was football rust from his injuries. I think this is a classic football coach move of benching a guy to send a message to him and the whole roster: We're starting the best, no matter who it is, when they were picked, what their contract is, etc. Hoge & Jahns made an interesting point in their latest pod, that for all the bluster over quality of practices and "we're gonna make them earn it" type shit Bears coaches have said, they really didn't arrive at the showdown. Eberflus, thus far, seems to be holding true to his word that his practices are going to be intense, and I for one am a big fan. These guys gotta toughen up.

[IE]

Athletic piece on it today, they seem to think it does say something about Jenkins specifically. I disagree and think it’s sending a message like you say, will see when camp opens.

The Athletic basically implied it was football rust from his injuries. I think this is a classic football coach move of benching a guy to send a message to him and the whole roster: We're starting the best, no matter who it is, when they were picked, what their contract is, etc. Hoge & Jahns made an interesting point in their latest pod, that for all the bluster over quality of practices and "we're gonna make them earn it" type shit Bears coaches have said, they really didn't arrive at the showdown. Eberflus, thus far, seems to be holding true to his word that his practices are going to be intense, and I for one am a big fan. These guys gotta toughen up.

I like the concept of getting Jones reps at LT & all the other young OL opportunities to practice with the first team and at least some shot at showing what they can do. It does make sense with a new regime & so many young and new players, that they want to make sure they have the clearest picture of the squad.

But with Jenkins maybe it is true that they want to send him a message. It may be rust and injury-recovery related. Cranking a few slow pitch at bats at a ballpark outing like that might not be a good indicator of whether he's really fully back and in the shape they want.

Jenk said he played last season at 345 and said he's now down to 325. Which really isn't that impressive, as a big guy like that can probably lose over 5 lbs taking a crap in the AM. It is *possible* he fudged that a little and he is still up around 230 when they want him down closer to 315-320. He looks big, and it seems like they're not going to tolerate that - sorft of the opposite of last year. I follow Jenk and the guy like to smoke and BBQ - so he might be not changing his habits to the extent they'd like.

[mmmc_35]

I hate how not secure this line is. I get its otas, and likely none of this means anything. It's not good though when 3/5ths of the line are completely unknown.

[Grizzled]

It’s way too early but there’s the philosophy that Borom and Jenkins lack sufficient experience after abbreviated use last year and should be playing LT and RT exclusively even in OTAs to give them more. But The team has to avoid the mistakes made with Fields last year, lack of playing with the 1sts, and see if Jones, Thomas, etc. can play.

[RichH55]

It scares me some to be honest

Hopefully just an early message

[IE]

I really think only 1/5 of the Oline has uncertainty, and on top of that they pretty much already have going-in positions on what they think they should do. All they're doing now is validating some of their thinking and giving some guys a chance to impress because they can.

[Moriarty]

https://www.chicagobears.com/news/quick ... n-minicamp

Kicking off their mandatory minicamp with the first of three practices Tuesday, the Bears continued to experiment with their offensive line.

As was the case during OTA workouts last week, the No. 1 unit featured rookie fifth-round pick Braxton Jones at left tackle and 2021 fifth-round choice Larry Borom at right tackle.

During the earlier stages of the offseason, Borom lined up at left tackle and 2021 second-round selection Teven Jenkins worked at right tackle.

The plan all along has been to try both combinations for six practices apiece.

"We're going to finish off the minicamp with this alignment," said coach Matt Eberflus, "and then we'll decide, 'Hey, we like this alignment, that alignment or don't like either one, so let's go with a new one.' We're just assessing guys' talents, assessing their skill level and going forward from there."

Eberflus would like to finalize the starting line as soon as possible to allow the unit to gel and give each player a chance to take reps at the position he's going to play. But the Bears simply don't have enough answers at this point.

"We're evaluating each day and we're going to find the best five for us going into the first game," Eberflus said. "That's a buildup process, and we're trying to find the combinations right now. We'd like to find them sooner than later, and when we do that we'll start repping it that way and do what's best for the Bears."

Asked if one of the tackles could move to the right guard position, Eberflus said: "All combinations are open, I'll just say that. I'm not going to comment on, 'Is it yes or no,' but I'll say that we have an open lens of all combinations are open."

[HurricaneBear]

I mean, I agree with the approach to an extent, but one would have hoped the highly regarded and drafted Jenkins would have come in and just owned the spot not allowing them to follow the script. Not reading into it that much as it's just OTAs and minicamp but it's also not nothing especially with how last year played out for Jenkins. Not ready to call him Gabe....yet.

[IE]

I mean, I agree with the approach to an extent, but one would have hoped the highly regarded and drafted Jenkins would have come in and just owned the spot not allowing them to follow the script. Not reading into it that much as it's just OTAs and minicamp but it's also not nothing especially with how last year played out for Jenkins. Not ready to call him Gabe....yet.

IMO this is an unjustified take. He's a friggin relentless bulldozer, and we know it. He showed his play style again last year a bit even with no practice and certainly not in shape. We know Flus loved him protecting his QB.

It isn't about his performance one way or the other. They almost certainly have him pegged for RT in their heads - but what IF Borom looks really good to them on the right and Jones on the left? Then who is best suited for that empty RG slot? Jenk. The story is Borom has impressed them more than they anticipated, so maybe they're feeling a bit mixed now who knows.

I think a better and more probable take is Jenk is a starter they're just trying to figure out all the other pieces. They said literally "we're going to start the best 5" - so let's just take him for his word that they're just figuring out what that is.

[HurricaneBear]

I mean, I agree with the approach to an extent, but one would have hoped the highly regarded and drafted Jenkins would have come in and just owned the spot not allowing them to follow the script. Not reading into it that much as it's just OTAs and minicamp but it's also not nothing especially with how last year played out for Jenkins. Not ready to call him Gabe....yet.

IMO this is an unjustified take. He's a friggin relentless bulldozer, and we know it. He showed his play style again last year a bit even with no practice and certainly not in shape. We know Flus loved him protecting his QB.

It isn't about his performance one way or the other. They almost certainly have him pegged for RT in their heads - but what IF Borom looks really good to them on the right and Jones on the left? Then who is best suited for that empty RG slot? Jenk. The story is Borom has impressed them more than they anticipated, so maybe they're feeling a bit mixed now who knows.

I think a better and more probable take is Jenk is a starter they're just trying to figure out all the other pieces. They said literally "we're going to start the best 5" - so let's just take him for his word that they're just figuring out what that is.

If they are moving people around to see things, why wouldn't they have slotted Jenkins in at RG with the 1s? To me if you know a guy is a starter you don't move him out of the 1s to see other guys. Have Whitehair or Patrick been rotated and I missed it? If they have then you are 100% right.

I want to be clear I don't think it's a big deal at all due to what time of year it is, my point is that it's not absolutely nothing for him to after several practices with the 1's to now be with the 2's. The reason could be as simple as you and the coaches said...or it could be something entirely different and we are being fed coach speak. I hope you are right. I won't be surprised if ends up being something else either.

And honestly, I don't care who starts as long as it is the best 5.

[wab]

We only know what has happened in the open practices. For all we know, Jenkins has played guard in some of the closed sessions. Flus has said they've rotated other guys into other positions that weren't OT.

I've gone back and forth, but I've come to the conclusion that it's not a great sign for Jenkins. He hasn't played a lot of football in the last year and a half and could really use all the help he can get.

At the end of the day I don't care who plays OT as long as Sam Mustipher isn't starting on the OL.

[wab]

Without making you give Lambert more clicks than he deserves...apparently Carson Taylor was giving Jenkins fits.

[Atkins&Rebel]

Lambert's take is that because Taylor wasn't a high round rookie he shouldn't be able to perform as good as he did.
Dent was like a 12 or 14 rounder right?
Draft slot has nothing to do with what you do when you get your opportunity

[Z Bear]

You mean a speed rusher is giving a power RT fits when there is only minimal contact allowed........shocker.

[IE]

If they are moving people around to see things, why wouldn't they have slotted Jenkins in at RG with the 1s? To me if you know a guy is a starter you don't move him out of the 1s to see other guys. Have Whitehair or Patrick been rotated and I missed it? If they have then you are 100% right.

And honestly, I don't care who starts as long as it is the best 5.

I agree I don't really care as long as they feel they have the right 5 to do the best job.

Flus said they had several packages/mixes of OL that they were rotating, and he said specifically for 6 practices each. They probably had some rationale but didn't share it other than to say they were evaluating the players and player mix. It is possible they didn't put Jenk at RG because they assume he'll be at T and they're just executing their evaluation.

Mockery said something silly along the lines of "if they're really evaluating why didn't Borom get demoted?" But to me it is obvious that you give the situations you want to understand the best the most looks. The story was they didn't like Borom coming in but then have been subsequently surprised. Maybe they just want to be sure they weren't right in the first place. And IMO they really would like to understand if a guy like Borom can really play on both sides. If he can AND Jones can play at LT for real, then they have their swing tackle and can make different decisions. I'm assuming Jenkins is one of the more sure things on the Oline (to start), and they're giving more evaluation to less sure things at this point.

You mean a speed rusher is giving a power RT fits when there is only minimal contact allowed........shocker.

Exactly. If he could play how he likes to play, it would be different. Zero concern. Mockery indeed.

[Bearfacts]

Deck the halls with bowls of Maui tis the time for preseason folly.

Speculators everywhere. Rumors abound. Jenkins is getting tested as he should be. Let's see how he responds.