Borom and Jenkins

[dplank]

I hate Quenton Nelson and laughed when he got rag dolled by some rookie last week. He's another narrative guy. He had some splash plays where he screamed like a Viking while pancaking some dude and a narrative legend was born. It'll stick right though his HOF induction speech I'm sure.

I don't watch enough Colts football to have my own opinion on the guy, I am just wary of the media narrative bs. I'm sure folks here watch every snap of Colts football and will tell me all about how great he is.

[Bears Whiskey Nut]

The thing is - is the move because:

a) He's failing at RT?
b) They've decided he's better suited to RG?
c) They're more desperate at RG?

a & b seem early & odd timing, but if that's the case, then they're just looking out for him
If it's c, maybe justifiable, maybe not, but sure not doing him any favors by giving him another challenge

d) They want their best 5 on the field

This is it exactly, and kudos to them for doing it. Schoenfield was terrible last week. The knock on Jenkins was always the short arms. He was RT in college because he could make up for it with his size and strength. Can't do that in the NFL. I think that they were waiting to see how Jones shook out at LT before committing to moving Jenkins inside. I also think the trade block thing was a way to motivate Jenkins. "Either get with the program, or we'll ship you out." Tonight will be very telling as to what to expect from the OL. If Jones, Whitehair, Jenkins, and Borom all look pretty solid tonight, we can adjust our expectations up just a touch on the season. Personally I think Jenkins can have the same effect inside as when they moved Kyle Long inside and he dominated as a G.

[HurricaneBear]

If Jenkins works out, it doesnt matter to me if its RG, RT or any position on the line. I'd love for him to work out and be the exception. I loved the pick when they drafted him. I cant ignore that most players who have had the NFL career he has so far wash out. If he can manage to get his shit together that would be what's best for the Bears. Until he proves it though i'm not getting my hopes up. Get focused and kick ass on the field for 10 years Teven.

[Grizzled]

I'd like to see Borom starting at RT or at least getting enough time to see if he can be a long term answer. Reiff might be better in the short term but this year's going to be one of assessing the guys on the roster. Kind of like Peters at LT last year but the Bears didn't have a Braxton Jones waiting in the wings plus Nagy/Pace thought the team was going for the playoffs and using personnel towards that end. It would be kind of amazing if the LT-C-RG-RT positions all became resolved this year.

[wulfy]

i'm trying not to be too irked, BUT I AM IRKED that he's getting a shot at RG this late in the game. I really didnt think they'd do that to him.
Maybe he thrives and it's all moot, but it's tough when he's been fighting back from injury and focusing on tackle to throw him into a guard spot mid-preseason.

The thing is - is the move because:

a) He's failing at RT?
b) They've decided he's better suited to RG?
c) They're more desperate at RG?

Yes

[wulfy]

They paid Reiff $10MM this year, I'd be surprised if they paid that for a swing tackle. But the best possible outcome is the Youngsters win the job.

[HurricaneBear]

They paid Reiff $10MM this year, I'd be surprised if they paid that for a swing tackle. But the best possible outcome is the Youngsters win the job.

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

[dplank]

I’d really like to see Reiff play a bit before I form any opinion on our RT situation, is he playing tonight?

[Bears Whiskey Nut]

They paid Reiff $10MM this year, I'd be surprised if they paid that for a swing tackle. But the best possible outcome is the Youngsters win the job.

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

No not at all. It's a 1yr/$3M contract, but he has to play X amount of snaps or games in order to get the full $3M.

[wulfy]

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

Then, the team signed Riley Reiff, an offensive tackle from the Cincinnati Bengals to a lucrative one-year, $12.5 million deal.

The contract turned some heads. Reiff is 33 years old and was one of the lower-graded lineman on the Bengals' offensive line last season. The value of his deal seemed counterintuitive to the Bears' strategy of signing short-term, minimum value deals until they bridge the gap to next offseason.

While on the surface, the deal seemed contradictory to Ryan Poles' plan -- it's not. Reiff's base salary is just $3 million. According to Brad Biggs of the Chicago Tribune, he will receive another $4.5 million if he is on field for 10 percent of offensive snaps and if the team improves in any of six offensive categories (categories unknown). Another $2.5 million is tied to playing time and there is a $2M playoff bonus..

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

[dplank]

That’s not too terrible for a swing tackle, especially given the uncertainty of the other guys we have. Like Schofield he’s a safety net to avoid complete disaster up front, which was a distinct possibility if a few things happened. I’m still happy with both signings and also happy to just let the best man win - with a tie going to the younger player.

[Moriarty]

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

Yeah the 10% threshold mostly just protects you against IR or cutting.
If he's healthy and on the roster, 10% of the snaps would be hard to avoid, even as the 3rd option.

[G08]

I'd love nothing more than for Jenkins to thrive at RG and Borom to thrive at RT.

That could be a young, potentially promising (way too early to tell) line developing in front of us.

[HurricaneBear]

I'd love nothing more than for Jenkins to thrive at RG and Borom to thrive at RT.

That could be a young, potentially promising (way too early to tell) line developing in front of us.

If the Bears could come out of this season with Jones/Whitehair or future FA/Patrick/Jenkins/Borom as the long term solution at oline...then Justin should grow if not thrive. If that happens the Bears championship window could be open as early as 2023. I'm not sure I believe all that will happen but I sure as hell hope it does!

[RichH55]

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

Then, the team signed Riley Reiff, an offensive tackle from the Cincinnati Bengals to a lucrative one-year, $12.5 million deal.

The contract turned some heads. Reiff is 33 years old and was one of the lower-graded lineman on the Bengals' offensive line last season. The value of his deal seemed counterintuitive to the Bears' strategy of signing short-term, minimum value deals until they bridge the gap to next offseason.

While on the surface, the deal seemed contradictory to Ryan Poles' plan -- it's not. Reiff's base salary is just $3 million. According to Brad Biggs of the Chicago Tribune, he will receive another $4.5 million if he is on field for 10 percent of offensive snaps and if the team improves in any of six offensive categories (categories unknown). Another $2.5 million is tied to playing time and there is a $2M playoff bonus..

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

Good stuff

[wab]

FWIW - I saw a blurb earlier (can't find it now) that Borom is down to 315 (below his goal weight) and that OL coach Chris Morgan has been incredibly impressed by him.

[Bears Whiskey Nut]

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

Then, the team signed Riley Reiff, an offensive tackle from the Cincinnati Bengals to a lucrative one-year, $12.5 million deal.

The contract turned some heads. Reiff is 33 years old and was one of the lower-graded lineman on the Bengals' offensive line last season. The value of his deal seemed counterintuitive to the Bears' strategy of signing short-term, minimum value deals until they bridge the gap to next offseason.

While on the surface, the deal seemed contradictory to Ryan Poles' plan -- it's not. Reiff's base salary is just $3 million. According to Brad Biggs of the Chicago Tribune, he will receive another $4.5 million if he is on field for 10 percent of offensive snaps and if the team improves in any of six offensive categories (categories unknown). Another $2.5 million is tied to playing time and there is a $2M playoff bonus..

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

Great find on the contract. So $3M is the base. The Bears could do Reiff a solid and tell him, "you're not the starter and may not get 10% of the snaps as our swing T, but we will still pay that amount if the offense improves in any of the categories in the contract. However you want to do it/word it, but make sure that he stays engaged and works hard has a mentor for the younger OL. Give him some motivation to help coach up the youts.

[Yogi da Bear]

I hate Quenton Nelson and laughed when he got rag dolled by some rookie last week. He's another narrative guy. He had some splash plays where he screamed like a Viking while pancaking some dude and a narrative legend was born. It'll stick right though his HOF induction speech I'm sure.

I don't watch enough Colts football to have my own opinion on the guy, I am just wary of the media narrative bs. I'm sure folks here watch every snap of Colts football and will tell me all about how great he is.

Kind of a weird post DP.

I love him. I wanted him so bad when he came out. We got Roquan instead. If we can't resign Roquan, I would absolutely love to spend that extra cash on Nelson. It's weird that you haven't looked into Nelson DP. He's the poster child for everything you've been saying about the offensive line. His presence has made the entire Colt line better. You really should check out some clips of his ore Jonathan Taylor. One great clip is the matchup with Aaron Donald, with each having their successes.

I can only hope that Jenkins can do for our line what Nelson has done for the Colts. Wham. And to have those two occupying our two guard positions would be a dream come true for me. But I don't expect the Colts are going to allow Nelson to leave. Heavy sigh. Oh well.

[RichH55]

I hate Quenton Nelson and laughed when he got rag dolled by some rookie last week. He's another narrative guy. He had some splash plays where he screamed like a Viking while pancaking some dude and a narrative legend was born. It'll stick right though his HOF induction speech I'm sure.

I don't watch enough Colts football to have my own opinion on the guy, I am just wary of the media narrative bs. I'm sure folks here watch every snap of Colts football and will tell me all about how great he is.

Kind of a weird post DP.

I love him. I wanted him so bad when he came out. We got Roquan instead. If we can't resign Roquan, I would absolutely love to spend that extra cash on Nelson. It's weird that you haven't looked into Nelson DP. He's the poster child for everything you've been saying about the offensive line. His presence has made the entire Colt line better. You really should check out some clips of his ore Jonathan Taylor. One great clip is the matchup with Aaron Donald, with each having their successes.

I can only hope that Jenkins can do for our line what Nelson has done for the Colts. Wham. And to have those two occupying our two guard positions would be a dream come true for me. But I don't expect the Colts are going to allow Nelson to leave. Heavy sigh. Oh well.

Nelson is a Top 3-5 Guard no question - He will not be there to spend money on though

The Colts used to really help out the LT with Nelson when I watched the Colts - it was an interesting use of resources (basically Nelson would shade toward LT on many of the passing plays)

The Colts line is not just Nelson though - thats a BS narrative

[dplank]

I hate Quenton Nelson and laughed when he got rag dolled by some rookie last week. He's another narrative guy. He had some splash plays where he screamed like a Viking while pancaking some dude and a narrative legend was born. It'll stick right though his HOF induction speech I'm sure.

I don't watch enough Colts football to have my own opinion on the guy, I am just wary of the media narrative bs. I'm sure folks here watch every snap of Colts football and will tell me all about how great he is.

Kind of a weird post DP.

I love him. I wanted him so bad when he came out. We got Roquan instead. If we can't resign Roquan, I would absolutely love to spend that extra cash on Nelson. It's weird that you haven't looked into Nelson DP. He's the poster child for everything you've been saying about the offensive line. His presence has made the entire Colt line better. You really should check out some clips of his ore Jonathan Taylor. One great clip is the matchup with Aaron Donald, with each having their successes.

I can only hope that Jenkins can do for our line what Nelson has done for the Colts. Wham. And to have those two occupying our two guard positions would be a dream come true for me. But I don't expect the Colts are going to allow Nelson to leave. Heavy sigh. Oh well.

I wanted either Nelson or Roquan that draft. I’m being tongue and cheek here, he’s a good player from what little I’ve seen outside of highlights. My point is that he could completely suck this year for some reason, and he’s still make the Pro Bowl and football fans who haven’t watched a snap of a Colts game would follow the talking parrots narrative about the guy regardless of actual performance.

Anyone here claiming they watch every game from every team is either a liar or needs to get a life lol.

[Yogi da Bear]

Isn't Reiff's contract like 1 and change million if he doesnt play X amount of snaps? I don't think his contract will force him to be penciled in as a starter

Then, the team signed Riley Reiff, an offensive tackle from the Cincinnati Bengals to a lucrative one-year, $12.5 million deal.

The contract turned some heads. Reiff is 33 years old and was one of the lower-graded lineman on the Bengals' offensive line last season. The value of his deal seemed counterintuitive to the Bears' strategy of signing short-term, minimum value deals until they bridge the gap to next offseason.

While on the surface, the deal seemed contradictory to Ryan Poles' plan -- it's not. Reiff's base salary is just $3 million. According to Brad Biggs of the Chicago Tribune, he will receive another $4.5 million if he is on field for 10 percent of offensive snaps and if the team improves in any of six offensive categories (categories unknown). Another $2.5 million is tied to playing time and there is a $2M playoff bonus..

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

As if to prove this point, last year Tevin Jenkins only played in six game, and only started two, yet he had 37% of the offensive snaps. 37%! Seems way high to me, but it is what it is.

[dplank]

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/bears ... t%20season.

I have to imagine 10% of the snaps, even as the swing tackle, is inevitable. That puts the base at $7.5MM ... I think you're right HurricaneBear, the other stuff is probably just fluff.

As if to prove this point, last year Tevin Jenkins only played in six game, and only started two, yet he had 37% of the offensive snaps. 37%! Seems way high to me, but it is what it is.

It’s literally impossible. 6 / 17 = 35.3%

[rtd]

As for what I saw last nite, Jenkins and Borum did well. OG is Jenkins spot lose. The oline did well over all.

[Bears Whiskey Nut]

As for what I saw last nite, Jenkins and Borum did well. OG is Jenkins spot lose. The oline did well over all.

I thought Jenkins looked good at OG. He is a mauler to be sure. He loves to completely dominate his opponent and try to put him on the ground.

[The Cooler King]

As if to prove this point, last year Tevin Jenkins only played in six game, and only started two, yet he had 37% of the offensive snaps. 37%! Seems way high to me, but it is what it is.

It’s literally impossible. 6 / 17 = 35.3%

Probably not literally impossible but you need some weird tails on game snap count standard deviation.

But I see 14.35% per pro football ref which sounds about right for 2 starts and some backup time.

[RichH55]

As if to prove this point, last year Tevin Jenkins only played in six game, and only started two, yet he had 37% of the offensive snaps. 37%! Seems way high to me, but it is what it is.

It’s literally impossible. 6 / 17 = 35.3%

Not how math nor impossibility works.

In some games you have more offensive snaps than others.

[Moriarty]

As if to prove this point, last year Tevin Jenkins only played in six game, and only started two, yet he had 37% of the offensive snaps. 37%! Seems way high to me, but it is what it is.

That's because that site reports Percent of Snaps In Games They Played In, not Percent of Snaps For the Full Season

[dplank]

It’s literally impossible. 6 / 17 = 35.3%

Probably not literally impossible but you need some weird tails on game snap count standard deviation.

But I see 14.35% per pro football ref which sounds about right for 2 starts and some backup time.

Nitpicky. It's ALMOST impossible. He only started two games, so there's really no realistic way that any deviation from game snap counts could overcome that. Had he started all 6 then I'd agree.

Technically it's not impossible that I could jump to the moon either. A rip in space time could open just at the moment I jump and send me through a wormhole that somehow lands me on the moon lol. 14% makes a lot more sense.

[RichH55]

Probably not literally impossible but you need some weird tails on game snap count standard deviation.

But I see 14.35% per pro football ref which sounds about right for 2 starts and some backup time.

Nitpicky. It's ALMOST impossible. He only started two games, so there's really no realistic way that any deviation from game snap counts could overcome that. Had he started all 6 then I'd agree.

Technically it's not impossible that I could jump to the moon either. A rip in space time could open just at the moment I jump and send me through a wormhole that somehow lands me on the moon lol. 14% makes a lot more sense.

This ummmm shows a bad knowledge of forecasting odds - Which in fairness humans are not great at.

Your first estimate was just a blanket assumption that every game has the same amount of offensive snaps - which is simply a poor estimate.

Does that mean you have to be able to jump to the moon?

You could just think out your posts a bit more beforehand - the topic will still be here that 35 seconds later

[Yogi da Bear]

From Pro Football Reference:

Snap Counts
Regular Season
Games Off. ST
Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Num Pct Num Pct Num Pct
2021 23 CHI ol 76 6 2 161 37% 21 14%

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... nkTe00.htm

Seems not so impossible. Still seems way high to me though.