Jalen Carter

[dplank]

They're just not going to sign 30 something guys until maybe the end to fill a hole.

Ngakoue is 27

[IE]

The Atlanta Journal Constitution has a full investigative report out today on the Jalen Carter crash. Its behind a pay wall but I was able to copy and paste it before being blocked.

I think the story is as expected with a few wrinkles including the fact that the police were considering charging Carter with vehicular homicide. And he is most definitely culpable in the affair based on the description of the race and his role "on pole position."

Legally, I think he got off relatively easy based on the story.

I must say though, seeing the photos and reading the details of the brutal crash really brings home what a tragedy it was; I can imagine why he's pretty shaken up about the whole thing.

If anything will change a guy's mentality an event like that will. This is a tough one - I could see him being pretty depressed and neglecting to prep adequately for the pro day, thinking "screw it - I know I've been distracted but I know I'll be drafted high and I just feel lucky for that". OTOH as some have posted here, he hasn't risen to previous challenges to get in better shape at Georgia, and that represents some risk. OTOH (how many hands do I have?) the Bears might conclude in interviews that he'll respond positively to HITS & if they do I think he'll clearly be the pick.

I'm guessing if Carter is there at 9 the Bears take him because despite this huge mistake post-championship celebration he was considered probably the top prospect in the draft. Poles is not going to ignore that. I'll guess that to not be picked by the Bears, Carter has to perform disastrously in interviews. I believe Poles does a lot of thinking but won't overthink this one.

How about this one? Bears pick Carter at 9 and then trade 61, 64 and 103 to trade up with Cincinnati at 27 and grabe AA. Walker, Billings, Carter & AA, Backed up by DomRob, Jones, Gip and a later round 1T? How good is that defense, adding those guys to the new LB corps and the Bear DB group?

[IE]

They're just not going to sign 30 something guys until maybe the end to fill a hole.

Ngakoue is 27

Oh yeah? Just wait 11 days. LOL

J/K - I thought he was closer to 30 my bad.

[The Kaiser]

I don't thìnk so IE... As I've been saying, drafting Carter here where this team has so many needs is just too risky.He has a history that is concerning and now it's possible he is, to put it bluntly, damaged goods. Of course he's not lost and redemption is possible but is that really where this team wants to focus now? I say we're just too early in this rebuild to take that risk, despite the possible upside.

[dplank]

Ngakoue is 27

Oh yeah? Just wait 11 days. LOL

J/K - I thought he was closer to 30 my bad.

lol, I'm not really a big fan of the guy I just want another competent body available as I don't have any faith at all in DomRob or Gipson and I don't want Poles to be forced to draft a guy higher than he should based on need.

My ever shifting thoughts on what we should do at 9 now lean towards the Alabama T or Paris.

[RichH55]

Oh yeah? Just wait 11 days. LOL

J/K - I thought he was closer to 30 my bad.

lol, I'm not really a big fan of the guy I just want another competent body available as I don't have any faith at all in DomRob or Gipson and I don't want Poles to be forced to draft a guy higher than he should based on need.

My ever shifting thoughts on what we should do at 9 now lean towards the Alabama T or Paris.

I don't think Poles - and granted we are currently only looking at 1 year of data - drafted predominantly for need.

Very few of us had Gordon/Brisker as the 2nd Round targets last year for example

[IE]

lol, I'm not really a big fan of the guy I just want another competent body available as I don't have any faith at all in DomRob or Gipson and I don't want Poles to be forced to draft a guy higher than he should based on need.

My ever shifting thoughts on what we should do at 9 now lean towards the Alabama T or Paris.

I don't think Poles - and granted we are currently only looking at 1 year of data - drafted predominantly for need.

Very few of us had Gordon/Brisker as the 2nd Round targets last year for example

True. That's why I've been zagging a bit from the general consensus that it is going to be a DT or OT, and thinking CB might be an area where they see a huge need. Like maybe they like Vildor OK but don't consider him a CB2 and then the other guys they brought in last year are good depth but not exactly what they want. And JJ... who knows what they think about him, because they like turnovers and he just flat out doesn't produce them. If they can get a CB1 with that first pick I believe it fills a need.

Not saying DL isn't a need - but they very well may have identified guys outside of the first round that they believe are DL starters especially at DE.

[dplank]

I don't think Poles - and granted we are currently only looking at 1 year of data - drafted predominantly for need.

Very few of us had Gordon/Brisker as the 2nd Round targets last year for example

True. That's why I've been zagging a bit from the general consensus that it is going to be a DT or OT, and thinking CB might be an area where they see a huge need. Like maybe they like Vildor OK but don't consider him a CB2 and then the other guys they brought in last year are good depth but not exactly what they want. And JJ... who knows what they think about him, because they like turnovers and he just flat out doesn't produce them. If they can get a CB1 with that first pick I believe it fills a need.

Not saying DL isn't a need - but they very well may have identified guys outside of the first round that they believe are DL starters especially at DE.

I understand your points IE and they have merit, but here is where I see things differently.

My logic starts from this premise, so if you disagree with this premise then please say so: I don't believe that you can field a competitive team with a trash DL. I also believe that if our DE's are DomRob and Gipson, then we have the worst starting DE's in the NFL. Our DT's are a little better (I'm assuming Walker is a DT). But as a unit, the DL is turdsville as it stands right now. So that's my premise behind the next point, you can't compete with a trash DL and I believe our DL as it stands right now is still trash.

So, building off that thought...

What I want to see is the floor performance raised for the DL. And I would consider it a major failure by Poles if he doesn't do that this year because if he doesn't, he's throwing the season away because there's no way we compete with the DL that we have. So, that leaves us with how he will do that.

I think it's a really bad idea to paint yourself into a corner on the draft and force needs. I understand pure BPA is a fallacy, but it is a generally accepted rule of thumb that you want to go into the draft with a few holes in your starting lineup as possible which allows greater flexibility in the draft. Right now, we have 3 major needs so that job has not been accomplished yet. 2 DE's (depending on where the Tenn guy lines up) and a RT are glaring needs right now again assuming the Tenn kid plays inside. I have removed DT as a hard need as we at least have Walker, Jones, and BIllings which isn't great but is a decent enough floor should the draft not break our way. Poles has done his job at DT, it's not spectacular but he has created an acceptable floor - now he needs to do that at DE as well. We can't roll into 2023 with DomRob at RDE, Gipson at LDE, and Borom at RT., I'm going to assume that point isn't up for debate as those guys all blow.

So, given the situation, combined with the fact that we have the most cap space in the league still by a decent margin, why wouldn't you want Poles to go ahead and spend on a couple more pieces to raise the floor of the DE and RT positions before the draft? It's SUPER risky to assume that you can fill those holes after the draft should you take a BPA approach - we just saw this last year with our OL and it went just as I predicted it would go. Those scrap heap signings aren't really providing a replacement level upgrade over the guys we have, it's just spinning wheels. It's equally, maybe even more risky, to go with your other plan of saying "well, Poles can just identify late round prospects instead". We know what late round prospects normally look like, they look like the current late round prospects I just mentioned that need to be replaced - DomRom, Gipson, and Borom are all 5th round picks I believe. Braxton Jones is an anomoly, not a plan.

There are guys out there that we can sign right now to 1 or 2 year deals that won't in any way impede the long term plan that Poles has for the organization and would allow him to enter the draft in a position of strength vs weakness. Those guys won't be there forever, so you are really rolling the dice each day you sit on your hands. By time the draft is over and another small wave of FA goes, you are looking at signing Schofield types who aren't going to improve your floor at all.

It's also worth noting that all I'm talking about here is how I can see Poles taking his B+ offseason up to an A+. I'm not hysterical. I don't hate Poles. I'm just greedy and I'm looking for something better all the time for our Bears. I'm sure the blatant liar will come on and say I hate Poles and all that garbage, that's noise from losers - I'm trying to engage in some interesting roster building chat from fellow fans whose opinions I respect!

[karhu]

I'd like to think that we'll add a vet or two later on in the preseason, but I wouldn't be surprised (or worried) if we waited until after the draft. As of now, it looks like four QBs will go before our pick, which leaves the rest of the field absolutely loaded with DEs (Anderson, Wilson, Murphy, and Van Ness, in whatever order you like). We're guaranteed one of those guys if anyone likes, say, a chastened Jalen Carter at a discount, or Gonzalez's godlike size and athleticism, or just needs a LT prospect.

And when we grab that DE, and maybe another one later on, our need for a vet decreases and our choosiness narrows. Right now, I don't want Ngakoue playing significant snaps--no more than any of the other teams he's played for. Dawuane Smoot doesn't get this far if his Achilles is intact. On down the line. Sure, go for Ngakoue and someone like Bud Dupree or Dante Fowler if worse comes to worst and the draft doesn't give us what we need. See if Leonard Floyd wants to come back. Pencil one in for after the draft. But there's a reason none of those guys has been a hot commodity to date.

Just because Poles has joined the entire league in not rushing to sign any of the remaining DEs doesn't mean he won't. It just means that they're relatively unimportant. Even to us. This is the wrong time to even think about drawing conclusions.

[dplank]

Your probably right Karhu, but I do worry about forcing DE there at 9 depending on how the board falls. If we go CB, for example, then I think Poles ends up getting caught with his pants down essentially as once Ngokoue and Quinn are gone I'm not sure what else is out there that would represent a decent floor. I'm fine with Ngokoue or Quinn as a rotational piece, I don't want high snap counts from them either. I'm more after lowering the snap counts from guys who can't play like DomRob and Gipson.

[o-pus #40 in B major]

You worry too much, dp.

Poles and his team are cutting edge and getting sharper.

[RichH55]

Your probably right Karhu, but I do worry about forcing DE there at 9 depending on how the board falls. If we go CB, for example, then I think Poles ends up getting caught with his pants down essentially as once Ngokoue and Quinn are gone I'm not sure what else is out there that would represent a decent floor. I'm fine with Ngokoue or Quinn as a rotational piece, I don't want high snap counts from them either. I'm more after lowering the snap counts from guys who can't play like DomRob and Gipson.

See its not the words are not rationally related to one another

I need a rotational piece on DL!!! If we don't get one- end of the world? Pants down? (and it assumes EVERY FA is signed and the draft doesn't exist after Pick 9)

And now we jump to the conclusion that DomRob can't play - because Poles picked him I guess?

We picked a DE who has legit traits but was a project! And he didn't get 10 Sacks as a Rookie!!!!! HE CANT PLAY!!!!!

[o-pus #40 in B major]

Your probably right Karhu, but I do worry about forcing DE there at 9 depending on how the board falls. If we go CB, for example, then I think Poles ends up getting caught with his pants down essentially as once Ngokoue and Quinn are gone I'm not sure what else is out there that would represent a decent floor. I'm fine with Ngokoue or Quinn as a rotational piece, I don't want high snap counts from them either. I'm more after lowering the snap counts from guys who can't play like DomRob and Gipson.

See its not the words are not rationally related to one another

I need a rotational piece on DL!!! If we don't get one- end of the world? Pants down? (and it assumes EVERY FA is signed and the draft doesn't exist after Pick 9)

And now we jump to the conclusion that DomRob can't play - because Poles picked him I guess?

We picked a DE who has legit traits but was a project! And he didn't get 10 Sacks as a Rookie!!!!! HE CANT PLAY!!!!!

AS A TANGENTIAL COMMENT, GENTLEMEN,

I still suspect that, in a subtle way, an entrenched fantasy football mindset can lead us to a static and inflexible view of players as individual works-in-progress - the path that a younger player follows is generally quite dynamic, with various twist and turns in his progression.

[RichH55]

See its not the words are not rationally related to one another

I need a rotational piece on DL!!! If we don't get one- end of the world? Pants down? (and it assumes EVERY FA is signed and the draft doesn't exist after Pick 9)

And now we jump to the conclusion that DomRob can't play - because Poles picked him I guess?

We picked a DE who has legit traits but was a project! And he didn't get 10 Sacks as a Rookie!!!!! HE CANT PLAY!!!!!

AS A TANGENTIAL COMMENT, GENTLEMEN,

I still suspect that, in a subtle way, an entrenched fantasy football mindset can lead us to a static and inflexible view of players as individual works-in-progress - the path that a younger player follows is generally quite dynamic, with various twist and turns in his progression.

Indeed - though its still fair to be down on Gipson.

I also expect Walker to move all over the Line

[HisRoyalSweetness]

How the Bears will evaluate the Jalen Carter ‘puzzle’
...

Bears general manager Ryan Poles said he’ll sit down with chairman George McCaskey and incoming president/CEO Kevin Warren as he tries to decide whether the Bears have interest in drafting Georgia defensive tackle Jalen Carter. He did the same with his bosses last year when considering players with character concerns.
...

‘‘Each prospect is a big puzzle,’’ Poles said. ‘‘You usually take it all the way back to high school, how they were recruited, how they handled that, and now you kind of play it through their career. Sometimes there’s red flags that pop up, and you’ve got to sit down and have discussions with different parts of your organization and say, ‘Does this guy fit what we’re trying to do?’ ’’

To try to get answers, the Bears will bring Carter to Halas Hall for an interview in the next few weeks.

‘‘You look at the risk,’’ Poles said. ‘‘You’ve got to balance that. And again, for us, especially being so young, we want to make sure we’re keeping a good culture and maintaining this as we go. When we get back [to Halas Hall], we’ll put it all back on the table and figure that out.’’

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bears/2023 ... caskey-nfl

[Yogi da Bear]

True. That's why I've been zagging a bit from the general consensus that it is going to be a DT or OT, and thinking CB might be an area where they see a huge need. Like maybe they like Vildor OK but don't consider him a CB2 and then the other guys they brought in last year are good depth but not exactly what they want. And JJ... who knows what they think about him, because they like turnovers and he just flat out doesn't produce them. If they can get a CB1 with that first pick I believe it fills a need.

Not saying DL isn't a need - but they very well may have identified guys outside of the first round that they believe are DL starters especially at DE.

I understand your points IE and they have merit, but here is where I see things differently.

My logic starts from this premise, so if you disagree with this premise then please say so: I don't believe that you can field a competitive team with a trash DL. I also believe that if our DE's are DomRob and Gipson, then we have the worst starting DE's in the NFL. Our DT's are a little better (I'm assuming Walker is a DT). But as a unit, the DL is turdsville as it stands right now. So that's my premise behind the next point, you can't compete with a trash DL and I believe our DL as it stands right now is still trash.

So, building off that thought...

What I want to see is the floor performance raised for the DL. And I would consider it a major failure by Poles if he doesn't do that this year because if he doesn't, he's throwing the season away because there's no way we compete with the DL that we have. So, that leaves us with how he will do that.

I think it's a really bad idea to paint yourself into a corner on the draft and force needs. I understand pure BPA is a fallacy, but it is a generally accepted rule of thumb that you want to go into the draft with a few holes in your starting lineup as possible which allows greater flexibility in the draft. Right now, we have 3 major needs so that job has not been accomplished yet. 2 DE's (depending on where the Tenn guy lines up) and a RT are glaring needs right now again assuming the Tenn kid plays inside. I have removed DT as a hard need as we at least have Walker, Jones, and BIllings which isn't great but is a decent enough floor should the draft not break our way. Poles has done his job at DT, it's not spectacular but he has created an acceptable floor - now he needs to do that at DE as well. We can't roll into 2023 with DomRob at RDE, Gipson at LDE, and Borom at RT., I'm going to assume that point isn't up for debate as those guys all blow.

So, given the situation, combined with the fact that we have the most cap space in the league still by a decent margin, why wouldn't you want Poles to go ahead and spend on a couple more pieces to raise the floor of the DE and RT positions before the draft? It's SUPER risky to assume that you can fill those holes after the draft should you take a BPA approach - we just saw this last year with our OL and it went just as I predicted it would go. Those scrap heap signings aren't really providing a replacement level upgrade over the guys we have, it's just spinning wheels. It's equally, maybe even more risky, to go with your other plan of saying "well, Poles can just identify late round prospects instead". We know what late round prospects normally look like, they look like the current late round prospects I just mentioned that need to be replaced - DomRom, Gipson, and Borom are all 5th round picks I believe. Braxton Jones is an anomoly, not a plan.

There are guys out there that we can sign right now to 1 or 2 year deals that won't in any way impede the long term plan that Poles has for the organization and would allow him to enter the draft in a position of strength vs weakness. Those guys won't be there forever, so you are really rolling the dice each day you sit on your hands. By time the draft is over and another small wave of FA goes, you are looking at signing Schofield types who aren't going to improve your floor at all.

It's also worth noting that all I'm talking about here is how I can see Poles taking his B+ offseason up to an A+. I'm not hysterical. I don't hate Poles. I'm just greedy and I'm looking for something better all the time for our Bears. I'm sure the blatant liar will come on and say I hate Poles and all that garbage, that's noise from losers - I'm trying to engage in some interesting roster building chat from fellow fans whose opinions I respect!

First, I don't understand IE's points, like at all. He begins by agreeing with the pointt that Poles doesn't draft for need so for that reason he won't draft a defensive or offensive linemen. But then he identifies CB as a need and for that reason thinks that that's what Poles is going to draft. "Poles doesn't draft for need, but CB is a need, so that's what he's going to draft."

...And I am left scratching my head.

Second DP, your whole stance might be true for the majority of the league. It's certainly how both Emery and Pace both operated. They tried to address all our need in free agency so that heading into the draft they could take BPA. In his first year, however, Poles showed a marked inclination on NOT doing that. In fact, he actually refused to address our most glaring needs with his first couple of picks.

Poles has said that he intends to build through the draft. As such, I'm afraid he's going to place much more emphasis on those later picks than you would like. Last year, for example, he was willing to wait until the fifth round to address our "positions of need" in the offensive and defensive line. And unlike you, I don't think he's even close to writing off our later round picks like Dom Rob, Carter, Kramer, Ebner, Hicks, or Gill. Being patient with late round picks is part and parcel of building through the draft. Hell, he's probably lamenting the poaching of Thomas by the Rams from our practice squad.

[Grizzled]

The Jalen Carter interview:



Going to be interesting to learn, if we do, what eventually influenced Poles to make his decision for or against Carter.

[dplank]

I understand your points IE and they have merit, but here is where I see things differently.

My logic starts from this premise, so if you disagree with this premise then please say so: I don't believe that you can field a competitive team with a trash DL. I also believe that if our DE's are DomRob and Gipson, then we have the worst starting DE's in the NFL. Our DT's are a little better (I'm assuming Walker is a DT). But as a unit, the DL is turdsville as it stands right now. So that's my premise behind the next point, you can't compete with a trash DL and I believe our DL as it stands right now is still trash.

So, building off that thought...

What I want to see is the floor performance raised for the DL. And I would consider it a major failure by Poles if he doesn't do that this year because if he doesn't, he's throwing the season away because there's no way we compete with the DL that we have. So, that leaves us with how he will do that.

I think it's a really bad idea to paint yourself into a corner on the draft and force needs. I understand pure BPA is a fallacy, but it is a generally accepted rule of thumb that you want to go into the draft with a few holes in your starting lineup as possible which allows greater flexibility in the draft. Right now, we have 3 major needs so that job has not been accomplished yet. 2 DE's (depending on where the Tenn guy lines up) and a RT are glaring needs right now again assuming the Tenn kid plays inside. I have removed DT as a hard need as we at least have Walker, Jones, and BIllings which isn't great but is a decent enough floor should the draft not break our way. Poles has done his job at DT, it's not spectacular but he has created an acceptable floor - now he needs to do that at DE as well. We can't roll into 2023 with DomRob at RDE, Gipson at LDE, and Borom at RT., I'm going to assume that point isn't up for debate as those guys all blow.

So, given the situation, combined with the fact that we have the most cap space in the league still by a decent margin, why wouldn't you want Poles to go ahead and spend on a couple more pieces to raise the floor of the DE and RT positions before the draft? It's SUPER risky to assume that you can fill those holes after the draft should you take a BPA approach - we just saw this last year with our OL and it went just as I predicted it would go. Those scrap heap signings aren't really providing a replacement level upgrade over the guys we have, it's just spinning wheels. It's equally, maybe even more risky, to go with your other plan of saying "well, Poles can just identify late round prospects instead". We know what late round prospects normally look like, they look like the current late round prospects I just mentioned that need to be replaced - DomRom, Gipson, and Borom are all 5th round picks I believe. Braxton Jones is an anomoly, not a plan.

There are guys out there that we can sign right now to 1 or 2 year deals that won't in any way impede the long term plan that Poles has for the organization and would allow him to enter the draft in a position of strength vs weakness. Those guys won't be there forever, so you are really rolling the dice each day you sit on your hands. By time the draft is over and another small wave of FA goes, you are looking at signing Schofield types who aren't going to improve your floor at all.

It's also worth noting that all I'm talking about here is how I can see Poles taking his B+ offseason up to an A+. I'm not hysterical. I don't hate Poles. I'm just greedy and I'm looking for something better all the time for our Bears. I'm sure the blatant liar will come on and say I hate Poles and all that garbage, that's noise from losers - I'm trying to engage in some interesting roster building chat from fellow fans whose opinions I respect!

First, I don't understand IE's points, like at all. He begins by agreeing with the pointt that Poles doesn't draft for need so for that reason he won't draft a defensive or offensive linemen. But then he identifies CB as a need and for that reason thinks that that's what Poles is going to draft. "Poles doesn't draft for need, but CB is a need, so that's what he's going to draft."

...And I am left scratching my head.

Second DP, your whole stance might be true for the majority of the league. It's certainly how both Emery and Pace both operated. They tried to address all our need in free agency so that heading into the draft they could take BPA. In his first year, however, Poles showed a marked inclination on NOT doing that. In fact, he actually refused to address our most glaring needs with his first couple of picks.

Poles has said that he intends to build through the draft. As such, I'm afraid he's going to place much more emphasis on those later picks than you would like. Last year, for example, he was willing to wait until the fifth round to address our "positions of need" in the offensive and defensive line. And unlike you, I don't think he's even close to writing off our later round picks like Dom Rob, Carter, Kramer, Ebner, Hicks, or Gill. Being patient with late round picks is part and parcel of building through the draft. Hell, he's probably lamenting the poaching of Thomas by the Rams from our practice squad.

Good post Yogi. I do want to correct one thing though…I haven’t written off those rookies, I’m not arguing I want the replaced and off the team. What I’m saying is that they aren’t ready for us to count on them as regular starters, so we need to add talent at those positions so that they aren’t put in that position.

DomRob should not have been out there last year, he wasn’t ready. I understand why it happened, total gut and rebuild and all that stuff, but last year was unique and I don’t expect Poles to ever be in full on “gut the team and tank” mode ever again. So some specific things he did last year is no longer appropriate going forward.

[Z Bear]

I will add the CB is probably one of the deeper positions in this draft so you can wait and get someone who might come in and win a starting job on Day 2, maybe even in to the 4th round. The same cannot be said for DT or DE. Pretty much once you get past round 2 all the dline guys are going to be projects.

[dplank]

I will add the CB is probably one of the deeper positions in this draft so you can wait and get someone who might come in and win a starting job on Day 2, maybe even in to the 4th round. The same cannot be said for DT or DE. Pretty much once you get past round 2 all the dline guys are going to be projects.

I suspect you can improve on Vildor with a 3rd or 4th round pick.

[Moriarty]

I will add the CB is probably one of the deeper positions in this draft so you can wait and get someone who might come in and win a starting job on Day 2, maybe even in to the 4th round. The same cannot be said for DT or DE. Pretty much once you get past round 2 all the dline guys are going to be projects.

I suspect you can improve on Vildor with a 3rd or 4th round pick.

Yes, you can.
But you want a guy you're going to be happy with going forward.

Improving on Vildor for 2 years, but then deciding you're still not happy with the CB situation, and spending a high pick to upgrade your R3-4 upgrade isn't good efficiency.
Vildor and Jones make for perfectly good CB4 & CB5. It's the high end that needs help. Jaylon is fine as a CB2, but isn't really 1 quality. Gordon is still mostly hope right now. They need a top guy.

Can you get a CB starter you will genuinely like a and want to ride? I dunno. I have a standard rule of never draft CB in R3. It's that awful zone where you convince yourself you're getting a starter who slid a little and it almost never works and you just end up pissing away a fairly valuable pick. Normally, you gotta get them in the top 50ish, or forget it. It is a deep CB draft and maybe this year is a rare exception. But I'm squeamish.

[dplank]

Fair post, but I don't really believe in the need for a "true #1" at the CB position though. I agree with that mentality at other positions, but not CB. I think 3 high quality starters is good, particularly in this style of defense. JJ is a borderline #1 in my book, he is really good. Gordon has massive potential and I like him going forward (although he has to prove it of course). A 3rd competent CB rounds the unit out, but doesn't need to be a Jalen Ramsey type IMO.

I would argue the direct opposite with regards to OL or DL though, so it is position specific for me.

[thunderspirit]

I have a standard rule of never draft CB in R3.

[Yogi da Bear]

Good post Yogi. I do want to correct one thing though…I haven’t written off those rookies, I’m not arguing I want the replaced and off the team. What I’m saying is that they aren’t ready for us to count on them as regular starters, so we need to add talent at those positions so that they aren’t put in that position.

DomRob should not have been out there last year, he wasn’t ready. I understand why it happened, total gut and rebuild and all that stuff, but last year was unique and I don’t expect Poles to ever be in full on “gut the team and tank” mode ever again. So some specific things he did last year is no longer appropriate going forward.

Sorry. When you say stuff like Poles drafted four OL and only hit on one or that you have no faith at all in DomRob, it sounds like you've written them off. It's good to know that you haven't.

[dplank]

Good post Yogi. I do want to correct one thing though…I haven’t written off those rookies, I’m not arguing I want the replaced and off the team. What I’m saying is that they aren’t ready for us to count on them as regular starters, so we need to add talent at those positions so that they aren’t put in that position.

DomRob should not have been out there last year, he wasn’t ready. I understand why it happened, total gut and rebuild and all that stuff, but last year was unique and I don’t expect Poles to ever be in full on “gut the team and tank” mode ever again. So some specific things he did last year is no longer appropriate going forward.

Sorry. When you say stuff like Poles drafted four OL and only hit on one or that you have no faith at all in DomRob, it sounds like you've written them off. It's good to know that you haven't.

Thx Yogi. When I say those things it’s within the context of our 2023 starting unit, and the several posts that have just assumed Poles can draft a Y1 starter at RT orbDE or wherever in the 5th round. That’s just not at all a reasonable assumption, downright nuts if you ask me. The odds are so against it, and so I point to 4 examples from just last year to that effect cause some folks think Braxton Jones types are just gonna happen with each and every pick. He’s the outlier, not the standard IMO.

We have 3 “must haves” for a complete roster, 1 OT and 2 DL. My contention is that we should fill these with vets so we aren’t pinned in on the draft, and if we don’t then we must draft these positions using 3 of our first 4 draft picks. And if Poles does neither, then he’s failed to build a proper roster heading in to 2023. All JMO of course.

[LacertineForest]

We have 3 “must haves” for a complete roster, 1 OT and 2 DL. My contention is that we should fill these with vets so we aren’t pinned in on the draft, and if we don’t then we must draft these positions using 3 of our first 4 draft picks. And if Poles does neither, then he’s failed to build a proper roster heading in to 2023. All JMO of course.

Agreed here, too - Putting yourself in a position where you need to draft someone to fill a hole is tough, but I do think that there are opportunities to shore up positions after the draft. Some of the free agents who are still out there are going to wait until after the draft to see where they have the best opportunity to either win a title (in which case, they're not coming to Chicago) or to get playing time if they don't get the money they were after. You'll also have some potential roster cuts during camp, but you obviously don't want to count on that to build a roster.

[HurricaneBear]

I think Poles sees the post draft FA pool as a viable source for those positions if the draft doesnt fall his way. I would have attacked them earlier with the higher end FAs, but I also think that at this point, there is nothing wrong with waiting. What is the difference between signing a Riley Reiff type in June vs now? By waiting he gets to see his draft picks perform with the team on and off the field. It's not like the Reiff's of the world have a huge adjustment period. There is not a shortage of them either.

[dplank]

I think the hope here Hurricane is by signing someone now you get a better player than Reilly Reiff. It’s a dangerous game Poles is playing waiting on Ngakoue, Clark, etc. if they get snapped up, he’s left with squat.

[RichH55]

I think the hope here Hurricane is by signing someone now you get a better player than Reilly Reiff. It’s a dangerous game Poles is playing waiting on Ngakoue, Clark, etc. if they get snapped up, he’s left with squat.

Luckily its not the most dangerous game!

Poles looks to be something of a Poker player/cool customer type.

It's just so odd to me that when there are FA left - AND MORE IMPORTANTLY - We have 5 Picks in the Top 105 - including a Top 10 - and we are like - How could we possibly add guys?!?!?!

But then again - I had to listen to 85% of an Offseason bemoaning that Pig Simmons was gonna be our starter. And that was on a worse pre draft roster with less draft capital

So at least we are consistently not learning.

[o-pus #40 in B major]

Luckily its not the most dangerous game!

Poles looks to be something of a Poker player/cool customer type.

It's just so odd to me that when there are FA left - AND MORE IMPORTANTLY - We have 5 Picks in the Top 105 - including a Top 10 - and we are like - How could we possibly add guys?!?!?!

But then again - I had to listen to 85% of an Offseason bemoaning that Pig Simmons was gonna be our starter. And that was on a worse pre draft roster with less draft capital

So at least we are consistently not learning.

There's only so much room for elite level intellects around here. Be thankful for what you have.