30 Visits

[Yogi da Bear]

I agree about the DE spot. I’m all for bringing Ngakoue back. He clearly isn’t “the guy” who makes it happen but his numbers once Sweat arrived were decent. I’m not paying him $15M but surely that won’t be his market after last year.

Not to mention that next year is supposed to be a BANNER draft for Edge guys. Poles may decide to roll with what we have for now and pick a stud DE next year.

Although I sure hope we aren't picking very high next, which limits6 us a lot. Draft Buzz has three in the Top 6 and then four from 16-20. One at 29 and then not another one until 38.

[docc]

List up to 19 x 30 visits with 3 notable prospects likely treated as "local visits."

List now includes:

- WR Malik Nabers, LSU (Rapoport)
- DE Laiatu Latu, UCLA (Fishbain)
- WR Marvin Harrison Jr, Ohio State (Fishbain)
- WR Xavier Worthy, Texas (Fishbain)
- S Kam Kichens, Miami (Leming)
- IOL Trevor Keegan, Michigan (Leming)

Fuck it..we going long...take them all..

[IotaNet]

Don't overdraft for a position of need when there are far better players still on the board.

Theres something to be said for this. Top 10 talent is top 10 talent.

We have two opportunities to pick blue-chippers, so that’s what we ought to do. Let’s go BPA.

We don’t know the next time we’ll be picking this high so we need to grab the studs while we can.

[thefish7]

Theres something to be said for this. Top 10 talent is top 10 talent.

We have two opportunities to pick blue-chippers, so that’s what we ought to do. Let’s go BPA.

We don’t know the next time we’ll be picking this high so we need to grab the studs while we can.

Totally agree with this. This roster is pretty strong in that we don't have any glaring needs (other than QB, resolution obvious), so 9 can be a pure luxury pick... best player on your board at that pick is the most rational move to me. I'm okay with a small trade down (10-15), but I don't want to trade 9 for a bunch of lower or 2025 picks.

[Hoog]

Not seeing Brian Thomas Jr. or Adonai Mitchell on the list in the event we trade down is troubling to me. Both guys offer the size, speed, and big play ability that would compliment Allen and Moore.

Xavier Worthy should not be on this list, imo. He is a combine darling who doesn't have the size or hands to make it in the NFL, imo.

As for Verse not being on the list, I had heard that while his numbers are good from testing, the film shows a straight line speed guy, who plays too stiff, and relies on his power. They guy I heard said once NFL tackles figure that out the will neuter him as a pass rusher. Might be why he doesn't have a visit.

[Bearfacts]

Not seeing Brian Thomas Jr. or Adonai Mitchell on the list in the event we trade down is troubling to me. Both guys offer the size, speed, and big play ability that would compliment Allen and Moore.

Xavier Worthy should not be on this list, imo. He is a combine darling who doesn't have the size or hands to make it in the NFL, imo.

As for Verse not being on the list, I had heard that while his numbers are good from testing, the film shows a straight line speed guy, who plays too stiff, and relies on his power. They guy I heard said once NFL tackles figure that out the will neuter him as a pass rusher. Might be why he doesn't have a visit.

While I don't disagree with you about their talent I believe it's more likely than not Poles will have either Turner or one of the top WR still on the board at #9. Let's say it's Odunze. If Poles has him equal with another WR like Thomas I suppose he could drop back a couple of picks and still get him but if a WR is the position he wants that's a risky move for only a 4th round pick.

This isn't an incredibly deep draft overall and with the roster spots fairly well filled a 4th round pick isn't likely to be a player who'll start unless it's a DL Flus can use in his rotation. If a blue player you like is there at #9 I think you take him and call it a day until round three begins. We're not only one player away from a championship but we sure as hell can use more blue chip players.

Verse will be a good player for someone but I don't believe he's the type of player Flus and Poles want for a RDE. Latu would but I believe Turner or Robinson have far more upside and don't have Latu's injury concern. The problem with getting Turner is most believe ATL will take him at #8. If Odunze is on the board at #9 do you take him or trade down for Robinson or Latu?

[Rusty Trombagent]

it feels kind of obvious if they're bringing in a bunch of top 10, top 20 guys that they arent planning on dropping down very far, if at all.

[wulfy]

List up to 19 x 30 visits with 3 notable prospects likely treated as "local visits."

List now includes:

- WR Malik Nabers, LSU (Rapoport)
- DE Laiatu Latu, UCLA (Fishbain)
- WR Marvin Harrison Jr, Ohio State (Fishbain)
- WR Xavier Worthy, Texas (Fishbain)
- S Kam Kichens, Miami (Leming)
- IOL Trevor Keegan, Michigan (Leming)

Since Latu is in for a 30 Visit, I guess that means his neck has checked out medically - which is great news. I'd really like them to consider a trade down to the mid-teens and pick up a second. If Latu is still on the board, it makes a nice target in the trade down also. (I still like Verse as well - and I read that NFL guys are much higher on Chop Robinson vs media and fans).

[LacertineForest]

List up to 19 x 30 visits with 3 notable prospects likely treated as "local visits."

List now includes:

- WR Malik Nabers, LSU (Rapoport)
- DE Laiatu Latu, UCLA (Fishbain)
- WR Marvin Harrison Jr, Ohio State (Fishbain)
- WR Xavier Worthy, Texas (Fishbain)
- S Kam Kichens, Miami (Leming)
- IOL Trevor Keegan, Michigan (Leming)

Since Latu is in for a 30 Visit, I guess that means his neck has checked out medically - which is great news. I'd really like them to consider a trade down to the mid-teens and pick up a second. If Latu is still on the board, it makes a nice target in the trade down also. (I still like Verse as well - and I read that NFL guys are much higher on Chop Robinson vs media and fans).

I don't think you can really make any inferences from top 30 visits. Greg Gabriel wrote an article recently where he talked about how much they used them as smokescreens so other teams couldn't tell what they were planning to do, and I don't doubt that Poles is looking at every one of these guys as potential draft candidates.

[wulfy]

Since Latu is in for a 30 Visit, I guess that means his neck has checked out medically - which is great news. I'd really like them to consider a trade down to the mid-teens and pick up a second. If Latu is still on the board, it makes a nice target in the trade down also. (I still like Verse as well - and I read that NFL guys are much higher on Chop Robinson vs media and fans).

I don't think you can really make any inferences from top 30 visits. Greg Gabriel wrote an article recently where he talked about how much they used them as smokescreens so other teams couldn't tell what they were planning to do, and I don't doubt that Poles is looking at every one of these guys as potential draft candidates.

I don't disagree - but at the same time:
1) I do think they would use a visit to ensure their medical evaluation on him is 100% accurate - thumbs up or thumbs down
2) I don't think Poles runs his shop like the Jerry Angelo Regime did and Greg Gabriel is a thin-skinned, blithering idiot

[LacertineForest]

I don't think you can really make any inferences from top 30 visits. Greg Gabriel wrote an article recently where he talked about how much they used them as smokescreens so other teams couldn't tell what they were planning to do, and I don't doubt that Poles is looking at every one of these guys as potential draft candidates.

I don't disagree - but at the same time:
1) I do think they would use a visit to ensure their medical evaluation on him is 100% accurate - thumbs up or thumbs down
2) I don't think Poles runs his shop like the Jerry Angelo Regime did and Greg Gabriel is a thin-skinned, blithering idiot

Agreed on both counts, there.

[Bearfacts]

I don't think you can really make any inferences from top 30 visits. Greg Gabriel wrote an article recently where he talked about how much they used them as smokescreens so other teams couldn't tell what they were planning to do, and I don't doubt that Poles is looking at every one of these guys as potential draft candidates.

I don't disagree - but at the same time:
1) I do think they would use a visit to ensure their medical evaluation on him is 100% accurate - thumbs up or thumbs down
2) I don't think Poles runs his shop like the Jerry Angelo Regime did and Greg Gabriel is a thin-skinned, blithering idiot

Number one I do agree with. It's a chance to check even deeper into any concerns they may have regarding Latu. But we're only gonna be able to draft four guys and one or two may not have even visited. In addition to it having some value as a smokescreen it also helps them build a file on players they may be interested in signing as FA down the road or trading for. Visits have value.

Number two I do not. Gabe has 100x more experience scouting and rating players than anyone around here. Is he opinionated? Hell yes, but maybe you get to do that after you helped build some Super Bowl teams. If he sees negatives in a player he's gonna highlight them because it's what he's spent his entire career doing and still does. He's far from a blithering idiot.

[crueltyabc]

No matter who they bring in for these visits, everyone knows the Bears are targeting an EDGE at some point in the draft. There's no need to create a smokescreen to hide something that would be absolutely no surprise to anyone

[wulfy]

@Bearfacts respectfully disagree on Gabriel.

[Bearfacts]

@Bearfacts respectfully disagree on Gabriel.

People who have strong opinions on things and won't be shaken from that stance are often thought of as being assholes especially when they don't give a rats ass what anyone else thinks of them. He's still engaged in doing some scouting and writing reports on draft prospects so there are those out there who still value his knowledge and experience. Much of what he says proves correct.

[Arkansasbear]

Don't overdraft for a position of need when there are far better players still on the board.

Theres something to be said for this. Top 10 talent is top 10 talent.

We have two opportunities to pick blue-chippers, so that’s what we ought to do. Let’s go BPA.

We don’t know the next time we’ll be picking this high so we need to grab the studs while we can.

I agree that top talent is top talent. But it differs from draft to draft. One draft you might draft a guy at 10 who would be a top 5 pick the following year.

For our pick at 9, I really only love the top 3 WRs, Alt and Turner (although with his size, I'm leaning more to really like than love). After those guys there are a ton of guys I really like. So a trade down to 15 still lets them snag one of those guys and and pick up extra resources.

I think Poles is of the same mindset. He will likely have a group of guys he won't pass on at 9 (granted if 2 are on the board he may try to do like he did last year and slide to 10 and get a little something). If they are all gone, he will look at the next group he has and see how far he could trade down and still be assured of landing one. I think they may like Verse more than Turner and he could be the guy they wouldn't pass on.

[dplank]

I don't see Turner's size as a problem really. He measured in at 6'2 247. I see a lot of Leonard Floyd concerns out there, but Floyd was an inch taller and 10 pounds lighter - he had a VERY slight frame. Turner seems more solidly built and will put on weight in the pro's naturally from age + continued workouts. He's not a monster sized DE by any means, but I don't think size is going to be a huge issue for him. JMO.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/dallas-tu ... 1d1c8f7101

Look at the highlights in here. Yes, you can't scout from highlights, but I wanted to point out something very different between him and Floyd. In the first handful of pass rushes you see here, what you see is Turner overpowering the LT for the sack. Not running around him, not blitzing off the edge, but straight up hand in the dirt, power rushing some very big guys from bigtime programs. Pushing them backwards. He's not Floyd.

Khalil Mack is 6'3 247 apparently. Power isn't just about weight.

[RichH55]

I don't see Turner's size as a problem really. He measured in at 6'2 247. I see a lot of Leonard Floyd concerns out there, but Floyd was an inch taller and 10 pounds lighter - he had a VERY slight frame. Turner seems more solidly built and will put on weight in the pro's naturally from age + continued workouts. He's not a monster sized DE by any means, but I don't think size is going to be a huge issue for him. JMO.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/dallas-tu ... 1d1c8f7101

Look at the highlights in here. Yes, you can't scout from highlights, but I wanted to point out something very different between him and Floyd. In the first handful of pass rushes you see here, what you see is Turner overpowering the LT for the sack. Not running around him, not blitzing off the edge, but straight up hand in the dirt, power rushing some very big guys from bigtime programs. Pushing them backwards. He's not Floyd.

Khalil Mack is 6'3 247 apparently. Power isn't just about weight.

I think Mack's combine was 6'3, 251 and now he's over 260. It's also a different frame and different beast. Different power - different everything.

Turner is alot closer to Floyd than Mack (pretty much overall)

There is also how you prepare for the Combine - if you are Mack you are looking to be closer to 250 than say 265. Whereas a guy like Turner - it's better for him to weigh more (various tricks for both sets of guys for the combine weigh in)

Turner really needs to add lower body size - which is the tougher add than just overall size due to being 24 than 21 - though your point on Verse (older ) is a pretty fair one

There is more literal room to grow for Turner

[wab]

If Latu hadn't had spinal fusion surgery in 2021, who to take wouldn't even be a question.

[dplank]

If Latu hadn't had spinal fusion surgery in 2021, who to take wouldn't even be a question.

I've had that surgery, in my neck, and was told never to power lift again. Granted, I had the surgery at 40 years old, but I can see the worry here. It's serious stuff.

[Arkansasbear]

If Latu hadn't had spinal fusion surgery in 2021, who to take wouldn't even be a question.

I agree

[Bearfacts]

I don't see Turner's size as a problem really. He measured in at 6'2 247. I see a lot of Leonard Floyd concerns out there, but Floyd was an inch taller and 10 pounds lighter - he had a VERY slight frame. Turner seems more solidly built and will put on weight in the pro's naturally from age + continued workouts. He's not a monster sized DE by any means, but I don't think size is going to be a huge issue for him. JMO.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/dallas-tu ... 1d1c8f7101

Look at the highlights in here. Yes, you can't scout from highlights, but I wanted to point out something very different between him and Floyd. In the first handful of pass rushes you see here, what you see is Turner overpowering the LT for the sack. Not running around him, not blitzing off the edge, but straight up hand in the dirt, power rushing some very big guys from bigtime programs. Pushing them backwards. He's not Floyd.

Khalil Mack is 6'3 247 apparently. Power isn't just about weight.

I don't get it either. Guys who play RDE are typically smaller and quicker than LDE. Last year we had Ngakoue at 6'2"/246lbs and prior to that he played for Flus at Indy. In 2022 we had Al Muhammad at 6'3"/247. Prior to that it was Robt Quinn at 6'4"/245lbs. Seems to me a guy going 6'3" and 250-260lbs is the type they want for RDE. Some here suggested Hassan Reddick whose 6'2"/240lbs. Turner does fit their profile for a pass rushing RDE. The guy who doesn't fit quite as well is Verse.

[The Kaiser]

Added JC Latham to the list.

Man, I wonder why no Byron Murphy II....I'm really feeling like a trade back to around #12 and then a selection of the best 3T in the class would be the best call here.

I wonder if they're genuinely not interested or if possibly they are trying to conceal their interest in him.

We'll know in two more weeks I guess...

[Atkins&Rebel]

Added JC Latham to the list.

Man, I wonder why no Byron Murphy II....I'm really feeling like a trade back to around #12 and then a selection of the best 3T in the class would be the best call here.

I wonder if they're genuinely not interested or if possibly they are trying to conceal their interest in him.

We'll know in two more weeks I guess...

I want to like Murphy, but I think he's the next disappointing DT that goes in the 1st round and is supposed to be a playmaker and ends up as a low end starter

while the kid can make plays, nothing stands out as elite to me about him.

[Bearfacts]

DT his size can be a tough sell but they can be effective 3 tech guys. Aaron Donald proved that and Calijah Kancey played pretty well for the Bucs last season. Murphy is heavier than either of them but about the same height. He could do well as a 3 tech DT but no one is gonna take him as a top ten pick.

[Arkansasbear]

Added JC Latham to the list.

Man, I wonder why no Byron Murphy II....I'm really feeling like a trade back to around #12 and then a selection of the best 3T in the class would be the best call here.

I wonder if they're genuinely not interested or if possibly they are trying to conceal their interest in him.

We'll know in two more weeks I guess...

I want to like Murphy, but I think he's the next disappointing DT that goes in the 1st round and is supposed to be a playmaker and ends up as a low end starter

while the kid can make plays, nothing stands out as elite to me about him.

I"m not sold on him either. You have to have some faith in what you've done recently. Last year they invested 2 high picks into the DT spot. I understand that if you can improve at a spot you need too (hence why LT may be in play at #9). I just don't see him being of such an improvement to take him. I still think Dexter has a super high ceiling and if they feel that way (they said they did when the drafted him and he wasn't a "bust") need to role with it.

[Bearfacts]

Flus had DeForest Buckner as his 3 tech at Indy. At 6'6"/312lbs Dexter is much closer to the size of Buckner 6'7"/295lbs than any of the top DT in this draft. And then we have Pickens as well. They say the biggest jump in performance tends to come in season two so it may be wise to see what we have with them before committing any more high picks to a DT.

[wulfy]

Flus had DeForest Buckner as his 3 tech at Indy. At 6'6"/312lbs Dexter is much closer to the size of Buckner 6'7"/295lbs than any of the top DT in this draft. And then we have Pickens as well. They say the biggest jump in performance tends to come in season two so it may be wise to see what we have with them before committing any more high picks to a DT.

Yes and No .... either way, you need rotational bodies at 3T with Justin Jones going to the Cardinals.

While I don't think 3T is the right move in round 1, later names we should consider are My Guy FSU's Braden Fiske, Clemson's Ruke Orhorhoro, Ohio State's Michael Hall Jr, and LSU's Tooka Smith (fits the 'flus length mold).

[Yogi da Bear]

A DT I like late is Jaden Crumedy from Miss. St. (Sweat would love that). He's 6'4", 301 with 4.97 speed. Fits Poles' profile along the DL.

[Rusty Trombagent]

Jaden Crumedy clearly a made up name cmon