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Z Bear wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:07 pm That the team that hired does not get picks. With the way the rule works it could end up having the reverse intended effect as there could be a team that decides NOT to hire a minority candidate in order to not give a rival an extra 3rd round draft pick for 2 years.

Yes, I understand your logic there

Z Bear wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:07 pm That the team that hired does not get picks. With the way the rule works it could end up having the reverse intended effect as there could be a team that decides NOT to hire a minority candidate in order to not give a rival an extra 3rd round draft pick for 2 years.

I think they want to avoid any perception that the pick is influencing the hiring decision. Like with the Rooney rule (and you heard George reiterate it in his PC) they want to stress equal opportunity.

Imagine the Bears hiring Caldwell over Quinn and Eberflus and all the fans going, "oh they only chose him for the picks". It creates a perhaps unfair situation for a guy going into a new role.

Being that it doesn't cost the hiring team directly hopefully it doesnt impact it from a rivalry perspective. If a guy is really that strong, you're weakening your rival more than 2 post 100 picks over two years.

I ultimately was split on any comp at all. But I think having comp go to the "developer" team is preferable than the other way. At one point I think a "bump" was floated. So the developer team might go up 15 slots from a predetermined slot. But I think some logistical hurdles might have complicated that.

Should be noted that the comp was only one change of a few to promote upward mobility for all hires. The Coordinator and "Secondary Football Executive" roles were added to give more protected roles and stop blocking and a requirement was made that removed certain non-compete language in coach/exec contracts that didn't allow them to pursue any opportunities. Those latter two changes benefit mobility for all, not just minority candidates.

Hmm, wonder if Dave Toub might be invited to interview?

Grizzled wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:34 pm Hmm, wonder if Dave Toub might be invited to interview?

What a hopeful thought. I am all in.

Z Bear wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:05 am Adams is not on the Bears anymore, they did not sign him to a futures contract.

That was a key part of the post, so thanks. lol

Yeah - I just don't see the Bears getting a sure thing top 3 WR in the draft, so I'm definitely predicting two FA signings. There is no depth to afford them the wait. It has to be priority #1 for Poles.

Well if you really want to get into it.... Pringle and Wilson are not better than Mooney, Olave/Bell are both going in round 1 of the early mocks, Goodwin kind of sucks. I do like Grant though if he can be brought back at a decent rate. So I think that would make a fairly shitty WR corp and be a disservice to Fields.

It's shaping up to be a pretty deep draft for WRs with no consensus top 12 guy.

R1:
Jameson Williams
Garrett Wilson
Treylon Burks
Chris Olave
John Metchie III

R2:
Drake London
Jahan Dotson
David Bell
George Pickens
Wan'Dale Robinson

R3:
Jalen Tolbert
Justyn Ross
Alec Pierce
Khalil Shakir
Calvin Austin III

London has a chance to go higher, just depends on his ability to participate. Obviously this is all super early too...

If Quinn ends up being the guy...maybe he tries to pry Calvin Ridley away. They need help on D... give them Goldman for him. Or a 3rd round pick.

If it's Eberflus or Caldwell...I could see them bringing in TY Hilton as a stopgap.

Pringle is an upgrade over Goodwin or Byrd...but I don't see #1 WR when I look at him. He'd absolutely be a #2 after Mooney on this team.

Sure just keep in mind Pringle and/or Wilson are what I think the Bears are going to end up signing. TY? I'd rather have those other guys. Ridley? That's a no brainer but do you really want to rely on that?

We'll see. I mean clearly Adams or Godwin are just studs and of course. And probably JuJu. But if the Bears aren't going to throw that kind of money around I like Pringle or Wilson over Kirk or TY or just about anyone else out there. Chark is another name that I think they could end up signing. He's probably as good as ARob so that might be worth a look if he's reasonably priced.

I'm not saying Pringle or Wilson are #1 WRs. I already said before above I think the true Bear #1 stud isnt' coming until the '23 draft. This would be a "stopgap of serviceable" that would be good enough to support JF1 along with some good RBs and a few TES.

The Marshall Plan wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:54 pm I need to say something and I'm not trying to stir the pot.

Normally I think the media at large, except for Tony Romo who I love, is a giant bag of shit.

I just would like to say that all the announcements I've seen are about the man, Ryan Poles, and his qualifications. Not a word about him being the first black GM of the Bears or whatever.

Just the man and his qualifications. As it should be.

Tremendous point.

Poles sounds like a qualified GM candidate, certainly. Nothing bad to say about him.

But this is how jaded I am. I've been through this enough times that I don't get excited any more. I'll just wait and see what happens. Part of me refuses to get excited because George and co. WANT fandom excitement, so we'll quit paying attention to the disaster that the ownership family is. I'll get excited when I have something to get excited about. Like a team that looks playoff worthy.

IE wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:11 pm Sure just keep in mind Pringle and/or Wilson are what I think the Bears are going to end up signing. TY? I'd rather have those other guys. Ridley? That's a no brainer but do you really want to rely on that?

We'll see. I mean clearly Adams or Godwin are just studs and of course. And probably JuJu. But if the Bears aren't going to throw that kind of money around I like Pringle or Wilson over Kirk or TY or just about anyone else out there. Chark is another name that I think they could end up signing. He's probably as good as ARob so that might be worth a look if he's reasonably priced.

I'm not saying Pringle or Wilson are #1 WRs. I already said before above I think the true Bear #1 stud isnt' coming until the '23 draft. This would be a "stopgap of serviceable" that would be good enough to support JF1 along with some good RBs and a few TES.

You've said Pringle would be the #1 WR like 3 times in this thread.

He'd be a stopgap #2 for a year or two, but IMO he's not a #1 over Mooney. Ridley (assuming his head is right) would absolutely be.

Now, having said all of that...if the Bears don't want to drop a ton of money on a FA WR, then Pringle is a good option. I like him better than Wilson. If they could get Pringle and say...DeDe Westbrook for a fraction of the cost of the top 3 FA's, then I'm absolutely for that.

Chark and Tre'Quan Smith are two other guys that interest me.

Mikefive wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:29 pm But this is how jaded I am. I've been through this enough times that I don't get excited any more. I'll just wait and see what happens. Part of me refuses to get excited because George and co. WANT fandom excitement, so we'll quit paying attention to the disaster that the ownership family is. I'll get excited when I have something to get excited about. Like a team that looks playoff worthy.

I very much agree with holding the excitement until you see something. Fans get prematurely revved up time and time and time and time again.


But I want to see an intelligent, articulately communicated plan for reconstruction, with early actions that jibe with what he said he would do.
Pace's 2020 Bears were "playoff worthy", but that didn't and won't do anything for me, if Poles helmed a team like that.

Grizzled wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:34 pm Hmm, wonder if Dave Toub might be invited to interview?

I thought about that as well .. but I've not seen his name mentioned ANYWHERE by anyone.

Perhaps his ship has sailed?

IotaNet wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:49 pm

Grizzled wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:34 pm Hmm, wonder if Dave Toub might be invited to interview?

I thought about that as well .. but I've not seen his name mentioned ANYWHERE by anyone.

Perhaps his ship has sailed?

If he is gonna you have to think someone like Poles is his best chance. I'd have definitely been open to it, though I don't know how well connected he is outside of Reid and Lovie. Probably a concern.

I listed him as the Bears #1 but that doesn't make him a #1 franchise WR type. I just meant they have to get someone better than Mooney. We can have slightly different opinions about Mooney or Mooney vs a guy like Pringle, and it doesn't really change my point. Personally I think he would be the Bears best WR over Mooney (still neither a "#1"). It wouldn't bother me if Mooney was labeled #1 and another guy #2 for '22. I just don't see the Bears exhausting immense resources on a #1 this offseason, and do believe they'll go with a group of #2-#3 type guys with a focus on guys who will be most reliable for JF1.

To me Trequan is in the Mike Williams pile... which is fast and talented guys who can explode in a given game but don't reliably deliver. I think the focus for JF1 absorbing a new system has to be reliability.

The Cooler King wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:58 pm

IotaNet wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:49 pm I thought about that as well .. but I've not seen his name mentioned ANYWHERE by anyone.

Perhaps his ship has sailed?

If he is gonna you have to think someone like Poles is his best chance. I'd have definitely been open to it, though I don't know how well connected he I'd outside of Reid and Lovie. Probably a concern.

If Toub was a real candidate, we would have heard his name long before this. My guess is that he doesn't have what teams are looking for in a HC. I mean, he was a great ST coach while he was in Chicago, but that alone does not a good head coach make.

IE wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 3:11 pm I listed him as the Bears #1 but that doesn't make him a #1 franchise WR type. I just meant they have to get someone better than Mooney. We can have slightly different opinions about Mooney or Mooney vs a guy like Pringle, and it doesn't really change my point. Personally I think he would be the Bears best WR over Mooney (still neither a "#1"). It wouldn't bother me if Mooney was labeled #1 and another guy #2 for '22. I just don't see the Bears exhausting immense resources on a #1 this offseason, and do believe they'll go with a group of #2-#3 type guys with a focus on guys who will be most reliable for JF1.

To me Trequan is in the Mike Williams pile... which is fast and talented guys who can explode in a given game but don't reliably deliver. I think the focus for JF1 absorbing a new system has to be reliability.

Fair points.

I think the strong Cauldwell rumours have cooled my jets significantly from the excitement and anticipation of yesterday.

If this is how Poles sees the future then it’s a “meh” from me.

Mooney, Pringle, Chark would give us a very interesting WR corps. Mooney and Pringle are quicker route runners with good hands, and Chark has some much needed size and isn't a slouch with his route running either.

Re-sign Grant as I think he was on the same page as Fields. Then you can draft a WR and TE to fill out our pass catchers.

The Bears need a bigger WR that is good at contested catches to pair with Mooney, who kind of sucks at contested catches. Mike Williams is one of the few that could potentially hit the market that fits that bill. I am not a huge fan of his since I think he has underachieved, but I could see the logic of bringing him in if you can get a decent value (less than $15M a year).

Throwing some more WR names out there: Christian Kirk, Michael Gallup, Russell Gage

I'd plan to draft a little more heavily on the defensive side of the ball because that's where the Bears are old. I'd be really reluctant to spend on defensive free agents as I'd like to be in the market for Ryan Jensen or Chris Godwin but if they can't or won't trade Mack and Quinn then you need to use FA to plug holes in the defensive back seven. The draft probably won't be enough.

I have to say Grant really grew on me. Not just the little scoring burst he had - but he is very similar to what Cohen was in '18. I think Pace intended him as Cohen's replacement. Given the Chiefs love of fast playmakers, I'd hope Poles works hard to sign the guy. That KR/WR/RB role provides so much flexibility. I always like those guys... the Dennis Gentry or Robert Green types.

Honestly Zbear I'd be pissed if they paid Williams that money. I don't hate the guy but he seriously disappears sometimes when you really need him. Vs guys like Adams or Godwin or even JuJu who seem far more reliable. Williams seemed to really let San Diego down as the season progressed... most of the season, actually.

I'm not a Gallup or Kirk fan. My focus is on how consistently reliable they are combined with affordability. I do believe Pringle is highly reliable in a Godwin-lite sort of way. I don't know that Ced Wilson is reliable but I think I've seen enough of some of these other guys to know they pretty much aren't. Chark is good and he's probably going ot be perfectly healthy. I'd like him to be one of two FAs they bring in.

Mikefive wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 2:29 pmBut this is how jaded I am. I've been through this enough times that I don't get excited any more. I'll just wait and see what happens. Part of me refuses to get excited because George and co. WANT fandom excitement, so we'll quit paying attention to the disaster that the ownership family is. I'll get excited when I have something to get excited about. Like a team that looks playoff worthy.

I've only been a fan since 2001 so this is only my 4th time on the GM carousel. Because of that, I'm definitely excited about what Poles is going to bring to the table. I guess the shine hasn't worn off just yet.

It's another example/admission of the team failing but it's also hope springing eternal. I know a lot of Bears fans are burnt out by all their failures but, hey, even a blind pig....

Z Bear wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 3:32 pm The Bears need a bigger WR that is good at contested catches to pair with Mooney, who kind of sucks at contested catches. Mike Williams is one of the few that could potentially hit the market that fits that bill. I am not a huge fan of his since I think he has underachieved, but I could see the logic of bringing him in if you can get a decent value (less than $15M a year).

You’re basically describing Allen Robinson…Mike Williams wouldn’t be a bad signing. The veteran free agents I wanted got hurt late in the season, so I’m not sure they are real possibilities now given that Fields needs weapons immediately.

I’ve been looking at WR’s in the draft and one sleeper guy I’m intrigued by is Christian Watson.

He’s listed at 6’4 with 4.4 speed. Not sure if that is true but he looks fast on tape but it’s against weak competition. Will be very interested to see his measurements and speed at the Combine.

I've been posting in the Eberflus thread about the connection that he and Poles share. They have built a solid relationship over the last few years. Partly, in my estimation, because Mike Borganzi (Poles' former boss in KC), his brother Dave Borganzi is Eberflus' LB coach in Indy. Eberflus has created a pretty kickass D for the Colts over the last four years, and I think he is Poles' guy. In other words, you expect your new GM to be connected and have a plan that includes HIS guys. I think that Eberflus is HIS guy, and I would be shocked if Matt Eberflus was not our new HC by tomorrow. A pick that has also been supported by "super consultant" Bill Polian. Stars are aligning, and I think Eberflus is the next HC of the Bears, and will be brining Dave Borganzi along as our new DC.

How about Caldwell, a solid young innovative OC, a solid young innovative DC and Toub as ST and AHC. Having a leader like Toub as Assist HC could free up Caldwell to work with the OC and JF1.

Just shitballing. Toub isn't a spring chicken either. But if Caldwell stepped away in a few successful years in that scenario Toub could take over and not change much of a thing like Seifert in SF back in the day... letting either the OC or DC to take over as AHC for their turn a few years later. I like the kind of continuity that could come from more experienced guys at the end of their career versus new guys that could bounce... IF they can secure and keep the fresh blood in the coordinator spots by making it clear there is a path upward in house. That's a challenge but a good organization should have assistants that can step in & step up.

Also, don't forget WRs that have underplayed their contracts who are going to get cut. Guys like Curtis Samuel or Kenny Golliday are possibilities. There might be others as well. Those are just off the top of my head.

Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 4:04 pm I've been posting in the Eberflus thread about the connection that he and Poles share. They have built a solid relationship over the last few years. Partly, in my estimation, because Mike Borganzi (Poles' former boss in KC), his brother Dave Borganzi is Eberflus' LB coach in Indy. Eberflus has created a pretty kickass D for the Colts over the last four years, and I think he is Poles' guy. In other words, you expect your new GM to be connected and have a plan that includes HIS guys. I think that Eberflus is HIS guy, and I would be shocked if Matt Eberflus was not our new HC by tomorrow. A pick that has also been supported by "super consultant" Bill Polian. Stars are aligning, and I think Eberflus is the next HC of the Bears, and will be brining Dave Borganzi along as our new DC.

With these connections and his connections to Quinn through Matt Ryan and Scott Pioli, he should have a ton of good background on them.

I gotta feel a bit for Poles. The guy started yesterday and is going to have to make a highly consequential decision pretty much immediately. Hasn't even worn ass grooves into his swivel chair yet and he could blow his entire gig with a bad HC hire.