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The proceedings are secret so we'll never know but one take I've heard is it would be hard to prove any of this just based on witness statements and no evidence besides text messages.

There's still civil cases to deal with though so it's far from over.

Boris13c wrote: ↑Mon Mar 21, 2022 2:51 pm that's the first time I actually read the detailed charges, and they paint a very negative picture of him ... so how is forced oral sex not considered something criminal according to the grand jury?

Probably because it didn’t happen. Forced sex is rape, if it was a credible accusation he’d surely have been charged for it. You shouldn’t pass judgement based on accusations that didn’t hold up to scrutiny, the truth lies somewhere in between. Poor, lewd behavior? Yes. Rape? No.

We will very much agree to disagree on that, @dplank.

I'm caught somewhere between believing Watson is a scumbag predator, and Watson was doing everything he could to smooth talk some extra services from mostly willing women, until he read one (some), of the women wrong, overstepped and now is facing the other 'willing women' looking to cash in.

Atkins&Rebel wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:07 am I'm caught somewhere between believing Watson is a scumbag predator, and Watson was doing everything he could to smooth talk some extra services from mostly willing women, until he read one (some), of the women wrong, overstepped and now is facing the other 'willing women' looking to cash in.

I am kind of here, but being on the outside looking in it is very hard to tell.

Is he a predator, a scumbag, a rich athlete being extorted or a privileged rich athlete that thought he was special.

The truth may lie anywhere within that realm and most likely we will never know what the entire truth is.

At a minimum Watson is a gross human who lacks social cues and basic awareness about decency because he's wealthy and doesn't believe the rules apply to him. On the other end of the spectrum, he's a predator.

I'm of the completely unsubstantiated opinion that he's probably the former. But there's still consequences.

Watson is really good. He's going to be quite a force, on a team with that running game holy crap. They're clearly all-in for this year and probably next.

IE wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:40 am Watson is really good. He's going to be quite a force, on a team with that running game holy crap. They're clearly all-in for this year and probably next.

Is Watson really that good?

28-25 overall record, 1-2 in playoffs, he gets sacked 9% of the time which is atrocious for both him and his lines.

I feel like maybe he’s a bit of a hollow stat guy, putting up the stats but not the wins or big game wins?

But, look at Stafford, he gets out of Detroit and he’s a champion.

southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:48 am

IE wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:40 am Watson is really good. He's going to be quite a force, on a team with that running game holy crap. They're clearly all-in for this year and probably next.

Is Watson really that good?

28-25 overall record, 1-2 in playoffs, he gets sacked 9% of the time which is atrocious for both him and his lines.

I feel like maybe he’s a bit of a hollow stat guy, putting up the stats but not the wins or big game wins?

But, look at Stafford, he gets out of Detroit and he’s a champion.

By your 4th comment you gave yourself my answer. LOL

Yeah - he's that good. If JF1 ever plays to Watson's level, we'll be elated.

southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:48 am

IE wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:40 am Watson is really good. He's going to be quite a force, on a team with that running game holy crap. They're clearly all-in for this year and probably next.

Is Watson really that good?

28-25 overall record, 1-2 in playoffs, he gets sacked 9% of the time which is atrocious for both him and his lines.

I feel like maybe he’s a bit of a hollow stat guy, putting up the stats but not the wins or big game wins?

But, look at Stafford, he gets out of Detroit and he’s a champion.

Yes. Yes he is.

The guy played on some shitty teams.

Then that playoff game on KC. He smoked the Chiefs and almost had them beat but that "defense" gave up like 50 points (IIRC) that game.

I’m of the opinion that he’s a prick but not a criminal.
There are lots of pricks in professional sport, I don’t like them but I can support the teams they play sport for. That’s it for me.

I’m not fit to judge someone really, but I can hold an opinion.

The Marshall Plan wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 11:33 am

southdakbearfan wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:48 am

Is Watson really that good?

28-25 overall record, 1-2 in playoffs, he gets sacked 9% of the time which is atrocious for both him and his lines.

I feel like maybe he’s a bit of a hollow stat guy, putting up the stats but not the wins or big game wins?

But, look at Stafford, he gets out of Detroit and he’s a champion.

Yes. Yes he is.

The guy played on some shitty teams.

Then that playoff game on KC. He smoked the Chiefs and almost had them beat but that "defense" gave up like 50 points (IIRC) that game.

Defense and Special Teams gave him the early big lead and he blew it there

His last season they weren't even top 50% in Points Scored.....and keep in mind that IS with a good WR crop (Fuller (actually decently healthy that year), Cook, Cobb)

RichH55 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 4:51 pm

The Marshall Plan wrote: ↑Tue Mar 22, 2022 11:33 am

Yes. Yes he is.

The guy played on some shitty teams.

Then that playoff game on KC. He smoked the Chiefs and almost had them beat but that "defense" gave up like 50 points (IIRC) that game.

Defense and Special Teams gave him the early big lead and he blew it there

His last season they weren't even top 50% in Points Scored.....and keep in mind that IS with a good WR crop (Fuller (actually decently healthy that year), Cook, Cobb)

Deal with it noob.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... tsDe00.htm

Rich has an axe to grind on this one, don’t bother it will devolve quickly. The guy lost Hopkins, then turned around and led the NFL in passing anyways - nuff said.

As for his legal stuff, I always wait for the legal process to unfold unless someone is literally caught on camera. No criminal charges tells me there’s a lot of gray area here and we will never know what happened exactly - sure seemed like a quality human being until this came out, like an exceptional young man - so while disappointed in his crassness I don’t extend it any further.

He should light it up for the Browns.

Dplank - absolutely loves to ignore that it was
A) A very good WR group

B) They weren't top 50% in points scored - You cant put that on the Defense or GM. Thats a QB thing. Someone who loves to take sacks

C) Ignoring multiple sexual assualts - Not a great look. Whats the equivalent of an axe to grind where you ignore a predator?

Dplank

What percentage of women do you think were lying?

Of the....checks notes.......22.

Twenty-Two.

RichH55 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 23, 2022 9:59 pm Dplank

What percentage of women do you think were lying?

Of the....checks notes.......22.

Twenty-Two.

25 actually. 3 other women are declining to sue because they dont want to go through the anguish of a trial.

Ultimately for some people it's just much easier to assume 25 women are lying than one man is lying. That's how things like this happen in the first place.

RustinFields wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 5:02 am

RichH55 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 23, 2022 9:59 pm Dplank

What percentage of women do you think were lying?

Of the....checks notes.......22.

Twenty-Two.

25 actually. 3 other women are declining to sue because they dont want to go through the anguish of a trial.

Ultimately for some people it's just much easier to assume 25 women are lying than one man is lying. That's how things like this happen in the first place.

I think most of us all agree that Watson was inappropriate.
With no charges it's fair to wonder if he was criminally inappropriate, (at least to all the women).
The civil trial will show us if the women want their day in court to vilify Watson.
An undisclosed settlement will just muddy the water and allow everyone to believe what they want.

RustinFields wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 5:02 am

RichH55 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 23, 2022 9:59 pm Dplank

What percentage of women do you think were lying?

Of the....checks notes.......22.

Twenty-Two.

25 actually. 3 other women are declining to sue because they dont want to go through the anguish of a trial.

Ultimately for some people it's just much easier to assume 25 women are lying than one man is lying. That's how things like this happen in the first place.

Excellent post

Atkins&Rebel wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 8:48 am

RustinFields wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 5:02 am

25 actually. 3 other women are declining to sue because they dont want to go through the anguish of a trial.

Ultimately for some people it's just much easier to assume 25 women are lying than one man is lying. That's how things like this happen in the first place.

I think most of us all agree that Watson was inappropriate.
With no charges it's fair to wonder if he was criminally inappropriate, (at least to all the women).
The civil trial will show us if the women want their day in court to vilify Watson.
An undisclosed settlement will just muddy the water and allow everyone to believe what they want.

Excellent post

Yeah, let's not.