NFL Admits Bears Got Screwed vs. Dolphins

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dplank
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Grizzled wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 4:06 pm The NFL is a multibillion dollar industry. Ref calls, even early in a game, can affect the outcome and cost a team a victory and their playoff standing. The big question is what should be reviewable. P.I., changes of possession, anything else?
Personal fouls / QB roughing
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dplank wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:31 pm
Grizzled wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 4:06 pm The NFL is a multibillion dollar industry. Ref calls, even early in a game, can affect the outcome and cost a team a victory and their playoff standing. The big question is what should be reviewable. P.I., changes of possession, anything else?
Personal fouls / QB roughing
[/quote

I can see both of these, they're bad for the individual getting fouled and the game.
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dplank wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:31 pm
Grizzled wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 4:06 pm The NFL is a multibillion dollar industry. Ref calls, even early in a game, can affect the outcome and cost a team a victory and their playoff standing. The big question is what should be reviewable. P.I., changes of possession, anything else?
Personal fouls / QB roughing
Every post is closer and closer to re-review everything except the Coin Flip

Presumably the FBI can handle the coin flip

Bad calls happen - sucks
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RichH55 wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:39 pm
Every post is closer and closer to re-review everything except the Coin Flip
What are you even talking about? Did you read any of the posts, or are you just trying to be an ass?
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Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 11:26 pm
RichH55 wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:39 pm
Every post is closer and closer to re-review everything except the Coin Flip
What are you even talking about? Did you read any of the posts, or are you just trying to be an ass?
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RichH55 wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:39 pm
dplank wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:31 pm

Personal fouls / QB roughing
Every post is closer and closer to re-review everything except the Coin Flip

Presumably the FBI can handle the coin flip

Bad calls happen - sucks
Constant sarcasm towards a handful of members isn't super endearing. Find some middle ground.
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My son and I are noticing a trend over the last 5 years. Certain teams get calls others don't. A lot like the NBA. If we get better maybe we get those calls.

Bad calls do happen. But it still doesn't make it right. Especially when the flip[pin ref is right there watching the damn play 10 feet away as was the case with Claypool.
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EricTighe wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 11:31 am My son and I are noticing a trend over the last 5 years. Certain teams get calls others don't. A lot like the NBA. If we get better maybe we get those calls.

Bad calls do happen. But it still doesn't make it right. Especially when the flip[pin ref is right there watching the damn play 10 feet away as was the case with Claypool.
Or as was the case with the Saints non-PI call against the Rams. The ref was RIGHT THERE looking at it. When crap like that happens, you can't help but think that something Hinky is going on. Especially when you've already had 4-5 calls go against you, including a bogus PI call.
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IotaNet wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 2:55 pm
The Marshall Plan wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 10:09 am The league acknowledges and fixes the problem on the same day the WWE fixes the problem with managers slipping their guy a folding chair.

All part of the entertainment.

For me, I want to see the FBI investigate corruption in sports and look at bank accounts and money movements.

The Sacramento Kings vs Lakers series isn’t the only time something like that has happened.
I hate to be "That [::cough:: tinfoil hat::cough] guy" but the partnership of the NFL with gambling interests really gives me pause in situations like this.

When you're talking about literally billions of dollars being bet on NFL games in a season, that's simply too much money to believe that someone can't be corrupted. Especially now that gambling is an official partner. Big money isn't about taking chances -- big money is about finding an edge.

I'm not calling for an investigation, but I think it calls for some serious thought.
This is partially why I won't bet on the NFL (at least, outside of Fantasy Football, which would be a little harder to fix at scale).

Say whatever you want about conspiracy theory, but I've seen too many games where it's blatantly called unevenly to favor one side or another, ESPECIALLY when the outcome will turn the game.
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BreadNCircuses wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 11:56 am
IotaNet wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 2:55 pm I hate to be "That [::cough:: tinfoil hat::cough] guy" but the partnership of the NFL with gambling interests really gives me pause in situations like this.

When you're talking about literally billions of dollars being bet on NFL games in a season, that's simply too much money to believe that someone can't be corrupted. Especially now that gambling is an official partner. Big money isn't about taking chances -- big money is about finding an edge.

I'm not calling for an investigation, but I think it calls for some serious thought.
This is partially why I won't bet on the NFL (at least, outside of Fantasy Football, which would be a little harder to fix at scale).

Say whatever you want about conspiracy theory, but I've seen too many games where it's blatantly called unevenly to favor one side or another, ESPECIALLY when the outcome will turn the game.
Right. Cause and effect can be debated, but the impact cannot. We see it every week in the NFL. The way the game is constructed (a super complex rule book) means that penalties play a MAJOR factor in the outcome of games - the games are littered with penalty flags (pure volume of penalties is a whole other subject worth discussing IMO, it ruins the game). Most of the time those penalties are legit and the team committing the foul is at fault. HOWEVER, we see more than enough evidence of blown calls that clearly impact the outcome of games that the situation must be addressed properly. The evidence is overwhelming, and the fixes are available even if not perfect. Perfection isn't the goal here, improvement is. It's the lack of urgency around the problem that leads people to wander into conspiracy thinking. Do something and folks will at least feel like they are trying and what mistakes remain in the game are more tolerable.

Interesting study done here: https://www.sportsinfosolutions.com/201 ... penalties/
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 3:23 am
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 11:26 pm

What are you even talking about? Did you read any of the posts, or are you just trying to be an ass?
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You make me laugh DP. :rofl: :toast:
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 3:23 am
Bears Whiskey Nut wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 11:26 pm

What are you even talking about? Did you read any of the posts, or are you just trying to be an ass?
CALL ON ME! CALL ON ME! I KNOW THE ANSWER!

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Moriarty wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:20 pm
The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 3:23 am

CALL ON ME! CALL ON ME! I KNOW THE ANSWER!

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This is almost certainly the least interested I've ever been in an Internet gif of a young woman jumping up and down
Next time I’ll look for one that shows the tits.
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:28 pm
Moriarty wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:20 pm



This is almost certainly the least interested I've ever been in an Internet gif of a young woman jumping up and down
Next time I’ll look for one that shows the tits.
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dplank wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:31 pm
Grizzled wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 4:06 pm The NFL is a multibillion dollar industry. Ref calls, even early in a game, can affect the outcome and cost a team a victory and their playoff standing. The big question is what should be reviewable. P.I., changes of possession, anything else?
Personal fouls / QB roughing
They review scoring plays, so I think they should review plays that if reversed would result in a score. i.e. they call the runner out at the 3 inch line.
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RichH55 wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:39 pm
dplank wrote: Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:31 pm

Personal fouls / QB roughing
Every post is closer and closer to re-review everything except the Coin Flip

Presumably the FBI can handle the coin flip

Bad calls happen - sucks
I'm equally fine with getting rid of all reviews.
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Too many games where a team gets screwed to the wall because of a ref mistake. Why should that be allowed to happen when it can be prevented and the best team wins? The NFL has moved on from leather helmets to protect players, let it make this change to protect the integrity of the game.
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dplank wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 12:12 pm
BreadNCircuses wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 11:56 am

This is partially why I won't bet on the NFL (at least, outside of Fantasy Football, which would be a little harder to fix at scale).

Say whatever you want about conspiracy theory, but I've seen too many games where it's blatantly called unevenly to favor one side or another, ESPECIALLY when the outcome will turn the game.
Right. Cause and effect can be debated, but the impact cannot. We see it every week in the NFL. The way the game is constructed (a super complex rule book) means that penalties play a MAJOR factor in the outcome of games - the games are littered with penalty flags (pure volume of penalties is a whole other subject worth discussing IMO, it ruins the game). Most of the time those penalties are legit and the team committing the foul is at fault. HOWEVER, we see more than enough evidence of blown calls that clearly impact the outcome of games that the situation must be addressed properly. The evidence is overwhelming, and the fixes are available even if not perfect. Perfection isn't the goal here, improvement is. It's the lack of urgency around the problem that leads people to wander into conspiracy thinking. Do something and folks will at least feel like they are trying and what mistakes remain in the game are more tolerable.

Interesting study done here: https://www.sportsinfosolutions.com/201 ... penalties/
Fantastic point about the complexity of the rules making the officials job more difficult. Absolutely spot on.

As a former official, something to bear in mind… your eyes tend to focus on what attracts your attention. This can present a perception problem when you’re close to the subject where you don’t see things that are obvious from a wider view. Observing that the ref was 10’ away indicates that he may have been too close to effectively see the foul. Did the ref blow the call? Definitely. Bu there’s a more likely explanation than it’s a fix.
Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.
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Mikefive wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 5:29 pm
dplank wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 12:12 pm

Right. Cause and effect can be debated, but the impact cannot. We see it every week in the NFL. The way the game is constructed (a super complex rule book) means that penalties play a MAJOR factor in the outcome of games - the games are littered with penalty flags (pure volume of penalties is a whole other subject worth discussing IMO, it ruins the game). Most of the time those penalties are legit and the team committing the foul is at fault. HOWEVER, we see more than enough evidence of blown calls that clearly impact the outcome of games that the situation must be addressed properly. The evidence is overwhelming, and the fixes are available even if not perfect. Perfection isn't the goal here, improvement is. It's the lack of urgency around the problem that leads people to wander into conspiracy thinking. Do something and folks will at least feel like they are trying and what mistakes remain in the game are more tolerable.

Interesting study done here: https://www.sportsinfosolutions.com/201 ... penalties/
Fantastic point about the complexity of the rules making the officials job more difficult. Absolutely spot on.

As a former official, something to bear in mind… your eyes tend to focus on what attracts your attention. This can present a perception problem when you’re close to the subject where you don’t see things that are obvious from a wider view. Observing that the ref was 10’ away indicates that he may have been too close to effectively see the foul. Did the ref blow the call? Definitely. Bu there’s a more likely explanation than it’s a fix.

I know the answer to this since I have been married for 32 years. Selective sight.

On that play there is one ball being thrown to one guy what in the hell else could he be looking at? One of two things happened. 1, NFL is getting like the NBA and the good teams get more the calls. 2. The ref sucks that was watching that play. Simple.

I think teams should be able to challenge inference calls or there lack of. That way if we run out of challenges that is on our own coaching staff and I can't bitch about the call then.
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EricTighe wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 9:47 pm
Mikefive wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 5:29 pm Fantastic point about the complexity of the rules making the officials job more difficult. Absolutely spot on.

As a former official, something to bear in mind… your eyes tend to focus on what attracts your attention. This can present a perception problem when you’re close to the subject where you don’t see things that are obvious from a wider view. Observing that the ref was 10’ away indicates that he may have been too close to effectively see the foul. Did the ref blow the call? Definitely. Bu there’s a more likely explanation than it’s a fix.

I know the answer to this since I have been married for 32 years. Selective sight.

On that play there is one ball being thrown to one guy what in the hell else could he be looking at? One of two things happened. 1, NFL is getting like the NBA and the good teams get more the calls. 2. The ref sucks that was watching that play. Simple.

I think teams should be able to challenge inference calls or there lack of. That way if we run out of challenges that is on our own coaching staff and I can't bitch about the call then.
Your point is patently incorrect as there were 3 guys involved in the play, not one. And the two defenders came from different directions. This stuff looks easy when everybody gets the wide angle view on TV, followed by the slow mo replay. But that's not the view the official had from 10 feet away. Maybe this is one of those things where... If you've never done it, it's hard to understand.
Mikefive's theory: The only time you KNOW that a sports team player, coach or management member is being 100% honest is when they're NOT reciting "the company line".

Go back to leather helmets, NFL.
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:28 pm
Moriarty wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:20 pm



This is almost certainly the least interested I've ever been in an Internet gif of a young woman jumping up and down
Next time I’ll look for one that shows the tits.
And if you throw a trampoline in there, you really got something.... :D
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 3:23 am CALL ON ME! CALL ON ME! I KNOW THE ANSWER!

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The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:28 pm Next time I’ll look for one that shows the tits.
What, this pair?

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Heinz D. wrote: Sat Nov 12, 2022 2:48 pm
The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 3:23 am CALL ON ME! CALL ON ME! I KNOW THE ANSWER!

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Yeah that question was a fastball right down the middle.
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HisRoyalSweetness wrote: Sat Nov 12, 2022 5:53 pm
The Marshall Plan wrote: Fri Nov 11, 2022 2:28 pm Next time I’ll look for one that shows the tits.
What, this pair?

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I said tits. Not dicks.

:)
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Sun Nov 13, 2022 5:35 am
HisRoyalSweetness wrote: Sat Nov 12, 2022 5:53 pm

What, this pair?

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I said tits. Not dicks.

:)
Ah, British slang. "A right tit" = a fool or someone who has said or done something foolish.

For example, when Ted Philips said ""Have we gotten the quarterback situation right? No. Have we won enough games? No. But everything else is there.” he made a right tit of himself.

On a related note, every time I see that photo of Ted and George I can't help but think of older versions of these two; the similarity is uncanny.:

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I think there should be no officials on the field except a guy to place the ball and blow the whistle.
Then there should be about a 2 minute gap between each play, during which a team of analysts can focus on each player's actions during the course of the previous play to ensure no penalties were committed.
After the all clear has been given, the next play may proceed.

They need to get it right.
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HisRoyalSweetness wrote: Sun Nov 13, 2022 9:02 am
The Marshall Plan wrote: Sun Nov 13, 2022 5:35 am

I said tits. Not dicks.

:)
Ah, British slang. "A right tit" = a fool or someone who has said or done something foolish.

For example, when Ted Philips said ""Have we gotten the quarterback situation right? No. Have we won enough games? No. But everything else is there.” he made a right tit of himself.

On a related note, every time I see that photo of Ted and George I can't help but think of older versions of these two; the similarity is uncanny.:

Image
The bottom two had demonstrably high IQs.
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dplank wrote:I agree with Rich here
RichH55 wrote: Dplank is correct
:shocked:
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Well I can't wait for this weeks letter of apology also
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bearsfaninaz wrote: Sun Nov 13, 2022 4:41 pm Well I can't wait for this weeks letter of apology also
I wouldn't expect a second one.
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