Teven Jenkins to LG

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wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 9:14 am
IE wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 9:07 am I like Jenk at G for sure. I think he can play outside too but believe he's a superstar at G and not at OT so why not have a superstar inside? He and Brax might be a good team over on the left.
Well there’s only so many positions left that they can move him to. And generally they don’t continually move (or sign replacements for) guys with superstar potential.
What would you say is the most credible accusation of what Jenkins did last year that caused all the drama?

I honestly don’t know. Read quite a few things but nothing I’d bet on.

This can’t just be showing up overweight and with an attitude problem last year.

He was arguably our best OL last season when healthy. Key phrase is when healthy. That knock on Jenkins I respect.

It just seems to me that moving him around this is an FU to him and will also stunt his development as a player.

Jenkins was:
Drafted as a LT
Moved to RT(?)
Moved to RG
Now over to LG

What a way to ruin a highly touted draft choice who when healthy does a great job.
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The Marshall Plan wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 3:23 pm
wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 9:14 am

Well there’s only so many positions left that they can move him to. And generally they don’t continually move (or sign replacements for) guys with superstar potential.
What would you say is the most credible accusation of what Jenkins did last year that caused all the drama?

I honestly don’t know. Read quite a few things but nothing I’d bet on.

This can’t just be showing up overweight and with an attitude problem last year.

He was arguably our best OL last season when healthy. Key phrase is when healthy. That knock on Jenkins I respect.

It just seems to me that moving him around this is an FU to him and will also stunt his development as a player.

Jenkins was:
Drafted as a LT
Moved to RT(?)
Moved to RG
Now over to LG

What a way to ruin a highly touted draft choice who when healthy does a great job.
So, here are my thoughts... Ultimately the root of the issue started with Juan Castillo and his preference of OL - big and mean.

I think Jenkins was drafted to play a position he wasn't well suited to play, but they chose to draft him as a LT because of his size, power, and demeanor. However, they ignored every medical red flag being waved around Jenkins' head and he ended up needing back surgery before the season.

In addition, because of Castillo's aforementioned preference of OL, they asked Jenkins (fresh off back surgery) to go from the 310 he was at the combine, to 345. So when he was finally able to play in the last month of the season, he was not only out of football shape, but he was also terribly out of physical shape.

Then comes the offseason, Flus, and the HITS thing. Jenkins, the anointed, yet grossly out of shape left tackle of the future, is asked to lose at least 30lbs. Unfortunately, by his own admission he doesn't hit that goal (it's reported he had only lost somewhere between 15 and 18lbs - contrast this to Borom, who had reportedly exceeded his weight loss goal). So he's immediately in the doghouse.

Then in camp when Braxton Jones seizes the LT spot from Jenkins, without much of a competition, they try him at RT...but there's still Borom, who has won over the coaches with his work ethic, and the freshly signed and highly respected Reiff. Jenkins is now not only still out of shape by the new coaching staff standards, but he's also relegated to RT...which is already a disappointment given that he was handed the keys to the LT job but he's now 3rd team RT. And reportedly very unhappy about it...and it's impacting him so much that he's getting beat by UDFA types.

So I think there is a combination of the staff having certain expectations and Jenkins not meeting those, plus the staff being very particular about what they want in an offensive lineman and Jenkins being very particular about how he sees himself as an offensive tackle.

Ultimately I feel like the seeds of discontent were planted the day he showed up not meeting his fitness goal.

Moving him around is just a function of the coaching staff not feeling confident enough in him being a part of the future to leave home in one place so he can develop.
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wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:29 pm
In addition, because of Castillo's aforementioned preference of OL, they asked Jenkins (fresh off back surgery) to go from the 310 he was at the combine, to 345. So when he was finally able to play in the last month of the season, he was not only out of football shape, but he was also terribly out of physical shape.

Then comes the offseason, Flus, and the HITS thing. Jenkins, the anointed, yet grossly out of shape left tackle of the future, is asked to lose at least 30lbs. Unfortunately, by his own admission he doesn't hit that goal (it's reported he had only lost somewhere between 15 and 18lbs - contrast this to Borom, who had reportedly exceeded his weight loss goal). So he's immediately in the doghouse.
I'm not remembering any specifics about weight at all. Do you have any links?
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Moriarty wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:38 pm
wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:29 pm
In addition, because of Castillo's aforementioned preference of OL, they asked Jenkins (fresh off back surgery) to go from the 310 he was at the combine, to 345. So when he was finally able to play in the last month of the season, he was not only out of football shape, but he was also terribly out of physical shape.

Then comes the offseason, Flus, and the HITS thing. Jenkins, the anointed, yet grossly out of shape left tackle of the future, is asked to lose at least 30lbs. Unfortunately, by his own admission he doesn't hit that goal (it's reported he had only lost somewhere between 15 and 18lbs - contrast this to Borom, who had reportedly exceeded his weight loss goal). So he's immediately in the doghouse.
I'm not remembering any specifics about weight at all. Do you have any links?
I’d have to go back and look for them. But in an article Jenkins said the old staff wanted him up to 345, and he missed out on his goal because he was only down to 327.

Then he made a comment joking about Borom being an overachiever and losing more weight than he was asked to lose.
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wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:43 pm
Moriarty wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:38 pm

I'm not remembering any specifics about weight at all. Do you have any links?
I’d have to go back and look for them. But in an article Jenkins said the old staff wanted him up to 345, and he missed out on his goal because he was only down to 327.

Then he made a comment joking about Borom being an overachiever and losing more weight than he was asked to lose.
Everything I see makes it sound like the weight loss went well.

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While I tend to agree with wab's thinking, he could be moved because Poles/the coaches see him as the best lineman and the most versatile. That is a possibility.
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wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:43 pm
Moriarty wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:38 pm

I'm not remembering any specifics about weight at all. Do you have any links?
I’d have to go back and look for them. But in an article Jenkins said the old staff wanted him up to 345, and he missed out on his goal because he was only down to 327.

Then he made a comment joking about Borom being an overachiever and losing more weight than he was asked to lose.
Sound right and how I remember it. I think the new staff made a bit of an example out of him for not dropping the weight, and I get why. New staff, new culture, can’t let an immature kid get away with that and set an immediate precedent that your HITS is all talk. The motivation appeared to pay off also, he was our best lineman last year.

Now I want to see Jenkins keep maturing and not let up, and the coaches/GM let that baggage go and give him a clean slate.
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dplank wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 5:46 pm
wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 4:43 pm
I’d have to go back and look for them. But in an article Jenkins said the old staff wanted him up to 345, and he missed out on his goal because he was only down to 327.

Then he made a comment joking about Borom being an overachiever and losing more weight than he was asked to lose.
Sound right and how I remember it. I think the new staff made a bit of an example out of him for not dropping the weight, and I get why. New staff, new culture, can’t let an immature kid get away with that and set an immediate precedent that your HITS is all talk. The motivation appeared to pay off also, he was our best lineman last year.

Now I want to see Jenkins keep maturing and not let up, and the coaches/GM let that baggage go and give him a clean slate.
If the former happens, I'd like to see the latter happen as well.
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dplank wrote:I agree with Rich here
RichH55 wrote: Dplank is correct
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I do not know anything about why he has moved or where his ultimate destination on the line is.....but, I know that he was absolutely good at points in the season. He hopefully has a year under his HITS belt and will become the guy that he is capable of being. I believe that he has a chance to become a pro bowl type lineman.
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First, i hope Jenk's health is back in full. When healthy he's a beast straight up. I sort of remember both Jenk and Flus say by later in the season that they came to an understanding & were good. I think he has a clean slate now.

It does look like they are torquing guys around but I think some of the ways it is portrayed are exaggerated. While we do know that continuity is important on the OL we also know that this regime has been clear from the start that they want the 5 best OL to play. That directly implies a guy or two could be playing out of their *best* position while they build the OL over time, and also that a guy can lose his spot when a better player comes in. For right NOW, they're valuing competition on the OL over continuity.

So right now: Brax is arrow up at LT and written in pen - but not stone, if a guy like PJJ comes in and takes it from him. I personally doubt that would happen - but it might. Davis is top 5 (if not 1) and he automatically gets RG. Jenk was the best OL last year so he moves to LG - and you have your two best OL at OG. Whitehair is then penciled in at C unless a rookie draft pick enables Poles to get rid of him. If Brax loses on the left he's got to compete with Borom at RT. I think Brax would win, and Borom goes to Swing T. At the start of year 2 and with some more fresh blood, they have to do what is best overall.

While they WILL encourage the competition I also don't think they give it a ton of time. Like, they're not going to give Jenk a bunch of practice at RT. I think they'll give guys quick looks and make quick decisions about who plays where. Since Jenk has proved really good at G he'll get put there pretty fast. What I hope is that if Jenk still wants to play tackle he is made comfortable with the fact that injuries DO happen in the NFL and oftentimes guys are asked to play out of position for a game or two. If/when that happens, Jenk will have opportunity to play T and show what he can do.
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Good post. The only outcome that would tick me off would be starting Whitehair at G and Patrick at C while benching Jenkins. I don’t believe that will happen, but I’d be pretty pissed if it did.
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dplank wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 7:55 am Good post. The only outcome that would tick me off would be starting Whitehair at G and Patrick at C while benching Jenkins. I don’t believe that will happen, but I’d be pretty pissed if it did.
I think it depends on how the draft falls honestly.

But I'm also one of the few that believes they initially wanted to leave Jenkins at RG, so they pursued a RT in McGlinchey...but when that didn't pan out they decided to sign a RG because they felt good about Jenkins working back out at RT.
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wab wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 8:01 am
dplank wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 7:55 am Good post. The only outcome that would tick me off would be starting Whitehair at G and Patrick at C while benching Jenkins. I don’t believe that will happen, but I’d be pretty pissed if it did.
I think it depends on how the draft falls honestly.

But I'm also one of the few that believes they initially wanted to leave Jenkins at RG, so they pursued a RT in McGlinchey...but when that didn't pan out they decided to sign a RG because they felt good about Jenkins working back out at RT.
Davis and healthy Jenk would be a nice right side. We'll see pretty soon. My guess would be if they go OT early then Jenk is sort of sealed inside for now. But if they go in other directions (e.g. DE / DT / C / CB) early and draft OL later I'd assume they think they have the starting RT on the roster already. That would be probably (in order): Jenk, Borom, Leatherwood.

Hard to tell what they think. It is easy to hear what the talking heads say about Bear needs & consider it credible - but those opinions don't factor in what the Bears think about their roster internally. This Bear regime seems highly disciplined, and I'm thinking even "insider whispers" are controlled and deliberate.
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He's a mauler and will make Braxton look better at LT.
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Maybe we are going CB in this draft if Jenkins is the T
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Lots of times "immaturity" in football players means DUIs and barfights. For Jenkins it's more like... he didn't know that mac n cheese and beer are not good for losing weight. He seems like a sensitive guy that needs more of a father figure from his coaching as opposed to a task master. I worry sometimes that our old school coaching staff only connects with one type of player that fits their very old school mode of operating and that limits the Bears in terms of what players they can develop. But I digress...

I think Jenkins is talented enough to play at an average-or-better level at T or G. If managed properly he could be a very useful player for a rebuilding team.
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crueltyabc wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 11:00 am Lots of times "immaturity" in football players means DUIs and barfights. For Jenkins it's more like... he didn't know he needed that mac n cheese and beer are not good for losing weight. He seems like a sensitive guy that needs more of a father figure from his coaching as opposed to a task master. I worry sometimes that our old school coaching staff only connects with one type of player that fits their very old school mode of operating and that limits the Bears in terms of what players they can develop. But I digress...

I think Jenkins is talented enough to play at an average-or-better level at T or G. If managed properly he could be a very useful player for a rebuilding team.
His mom died when he was quite young and I'm sure it's been a really difficult road for him mental/emotional health-wise ever since.
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I think Tevin is still in prove it mode with this Coaching staff. Needs to come in and just put his nose to the grind stone and put last years issues (Whatever they were) to bed.
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UOK wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 11:03 am
crueltyabc wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 11:00 am Lots of times "immaturity" in football players means DUIs and barfights. For Jenkins it's more like... he didn't know he needed that mac n cheese and beer are not good for losing weight. He seems like a sensitive guy that needs more of a father figure from his coaching as opposed to a task master. I worry sometimes that our old school coaching staff only connects with one type of player that fits their very old school mode of operating and that limits the Bears in terms of what players they can develop. But I digress...

I think Jenkins is talented enough to play at an average-or-better level at T or G. If managed properly he could be a very useful player for a rebuilding team.
His mom died when he was quite young and I'm sure it's been a really difficult road for him mental/emotional health-wise ever since.
I didn't know that but it aligns perfectly with the vibe I get from his interviews. Even the way he 1) has a fiancée at a young age and 2) talks about her makes it some like she has a caretaking role for him. I hope there's someone on the Bears staff who can meet him where he's at.
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Consider the source, I know many here are sour on Gabriel (I don't know what I think about him personally):
Greg Gabriel via Twitter wrote:Shortly after the Bears acquired Nate Davis I was told Davis was going to play LG and Tevin would stay at RG. Since then the plan has changed and Davis is staying at RG. Regardless, the Bears are strong at the guard position.
He has also said the Bears are absolutely not going to draft JS-N at 9.
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wulfy wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 11:15 am Consider the source, I know many here are sour on Gabriel (I don't know what I think about him personally):
Greg Gabriel via Twitter wrote:Shortly after the Bears acquired Nate Davis I was told Davis was going to play LG and Tevin would stay at RG. Since then the plan has changed and Davis is staying at RG. Regardless, the Bears are strong at the guard position.
He has also said the Bears are absolutely not going to draft JS-N at 9.
So if they do draft him them "the plan changed" lol
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This is a great thread about Jenkins. I'm happy to see that it also sheds some positive light on Coach Flus.

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duckherd50 wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:18 am Maybe we are going CB in this draft if Jenkins is the T
That's my thinking. IF they don't grab an OT at 9 I'm guessing they pick an elite CB. And they may be able to trade down and still grab a guy like Witherspoon along with another 2nd or high 3rd... I think that would be a coup.

My belief is the moves & non-moves so far indicate they're building depth and rotation with ascending versatile athletes. I think they're going to continue in that vein and are not going to be upset about missing out on a couple of guys in the top 10. There are some explosive interior DL not named Carter that will be available later in the 1st, in the 2nd round, and even 3rd.

IF they trade down and go defense with the first pick or two, I think that would be very encouraging to Jenk-back-to-RT supporters.
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IE wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 7:32 am ...both Jenk and Flus say by later in the season that they came to an understanding & were good. I think he has a clean slate now...
Key point in why I say Jenkins is the RT.
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Leatherwood is going to claim that RT spot.

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Ditka’s dictaphone wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 2:35 pm Leatherwood is going to claim that RT spot.

Pro-bowler next season :clap:
Speak it into existence! Would be incredible for the Bears. Hopefully he works out better than Poles' other in-season waiver moves.
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I think Leatherwood will win LG
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The Grizzly One wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 7:53 pm I think Leatherwood will win LG
I'm gonna presume this stands for 'let go'
Last edited by The Cooler King on Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:01 am, edited 2 times in total.
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The Cooler King wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 8:50 pm
The Grizzly One wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 7:53 pm I think Leatherwood will win LG
I'm gonna presume thus syands for 'let go'
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wab wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 8:42 am
Grizzled wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 8:31 am

Shades of Chris Williams. I was listening to the draft on the radio, muttering against drafting him for his med report, which said 'bad back' and his attitude, which said 'soft'. I wanted Brandon Albert, who didn't exactly tear up the league but wasn't a medical disaster.
I wanted Ryan Clady, bout when he got picked by the Broncos, I preferred Albert to Williams. I think the reason they passed on Albert was that a lot of teams saw him only as a guard - which is ironic since Albert spent most of his career at LT and Williams spent most of his at guard.

Albert was a solid offensive lineman for a decade.
I wanted Brandon Albert as well that year.
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